Oubliette

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Posts by Oubliette

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  41

  A Tug on the Leash (The Authority Which the GB Wields Over the R&F)

  by Oubliette in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  recently, several comments have been made in various threads in reference to some of the recent changes to a few of the rules by which jehovah's witnesses must live their lives in unquestioning compliance.

  the assertion has been made that these rules are a "relaxing" of previous restrictions.

  the suggestion has been made that this somehow indicates a corresponding relaxing or loosening or lessening of the authority which the governing body (gb) holds over the rank and file (r&f) members of the religion.

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  Oubliette

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  Bumpin' it for FT and all lurkers!
  

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  22

  1919 Doctrine no longer exists? (Today's Watchtower Study)

  by FusionTheism in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  quote from today's watchtower study article that's being studied at the halls (march 15, 2015, page 24):.

  "understanding the illustration of the talents".

  "when the master rewards the slaves.".

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  Oubliette

  FT: So they have erased their doctrine about 1919?

  No. But you clearly have trouble understanding English, not that this week's Watchtower is exactly a model of clarity of thought or precision of language. The prose is (I believe) deliberately abstruse.
  

  Twisted, tweaking, vacillating and equivocating obfuscation is not an erasure. It is at best a sign of muddled thinking by lazy, untrained and/or undisciplined minds not up to the task of trying to explicate scripture. At worst, it is evidence of skilled manipulators yanking the chain of their blindly obedient cult members. Misdirection is the stock in trade of sleight of hand magicians and their rhetorical counterparts: snake-oil con-men.

  The difference is that the former practice their arts for entertainment, while the latter utter prosaic nonsense for the purpose of manipulating and defrauding the gullible and the naive for their own enrichment. One is a fun diversion, the other is criminal.
  

  No matter how you slice or dice it: It's a cult!

  
  
  

  
  

  
  
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  53

  Spirituality

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely.

  im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience.

  i'm currently reading sam harris book waking up and it's very good so far.

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  Oubliette

  JD, I think so.

  As I posted earlier, I think that Sam Harris did not clearly articulate what really should have been the main point of his book.

  That being said, he did get a dialogue started, right?

  This boundary between our conscious and unconscious desires, the voluntary and the involuntary motivations that move us, is not one that is either clearly defined or well understood. It's kind of like trying to see the back of your head. You need at least two mirrors to do that.

  • What are the mirrors to our soul?
    

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  I believe the exploration is a worthwhile undertaking even if no final destination is ever found.

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  134

  Young Girl Exposes Jehovah's Witnesses at school video goes VIRAL last 2 days 273,000 views

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  original thread here.

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/291080001/brave-high-school-student-exposes-abuse-corruption-within-jehovahs-witnesses.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdvt_gyq-ls.

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  Oubliette

  322,659 views and counting!
  
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  27

  Assembly today, Survival Tips and Recommendations Please!

  by Blackfalcon98 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so there's an indoctrination session tomorrow......any tips for getting through with my sanity intact?

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  Oubliette

  So there's an indoctrination session tomorrow......any tips for getting through with my sanity intact?

  Yeah, don't go.

  But if you must, use it as an opportunity to learn to spot logical fallacies, techniques of manipulation, outright lies, and examples of hypocrisy.

  That'll keep you busy and at least make your experience somewhat productive.
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  88

  Damned if they do, Damned if they don't

  by FusionTheism in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.

  i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.

  also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.

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  Oubliette

  opusdei1972, thank you for showing clear evidence from the WTBTS's own literature that FT is completely wrong.
  

  I'm sure it did not take you a great deal of time or effort to find these quotes.

  I would ask that you consider this next time you are tempted to "refute" a JW apologist on this forum: When they make ridiculous claims, demand that they prove those claims.

  Twice I asked FT to back up his assertions. He completely ignored my first request for proof. His response to my second request was, "no I'm not going to spend my entire off day to provide you the exact page numbers of each change."

  He didn't provide quotes because he couldn't. Lurkers and fence-sitters need to see this.

  You're quotations completely refuting his nonsense securely put the last nails in the coffin regarding his ridiculous claims.

  You cannot defend the indefensible.
  
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  53

  Spirituality

  by Jonathan Drake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if you are a current practitioner of some religious faith i would appreciate it if you abstained from this thread entirely.

  im curious if anyone has had what could be discribed as a spiritual experience.

  i'm currently reading sam harris book waking up and it's very good so far.

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  Oubliette

  JD, I'm glad you are attempting these exercises and exploring what it means to be conscious and self-aware.

  Do not confuse the fact that some things are involuntary with the idea that all things are involuntary.
  
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  31

  Bro Loesch's talk.

  by New day in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  recently i heard through video link to our kh a talk by bro loesch where he attacked university study (again) but this time he prefaced his remarks by saying, and i quote, "the faithful slave does not forbid you to go to university.

  " so this was a bad start as his following remarks made it clear that this was just a way of seeming reasonable while basically saying that we shouldn't do it.

  he went on to use an illustration i think he has used before about a man with ocd who decided to kill himself.

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  Oubliette

  "I do not answer to Watchtower. … Watchtower does not have, and never has had, any authority over me" - Declaration of Gerrit Lösch to the Superior Court of the State of California, County of San Diego, signed and dated the 4th day of February 2014
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  15

  Any good answers at this Sunday's WT?

  by Lemonp in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously this weeks' wt has been part 3 of big changes in the doctrine.

  at the end i answered up saying along the lines of: "as we can see from the illustration box, when it comes to the reward being given to the slaves, divine appointment was not given in 1919. this will happen in future when the anointed get taken before armageddon".

  i couldn't bring myself to say "raptured at armageddon" as i think people might have taken a closer look at me...but it felt good to call out publicly the bull sh#t date of 1919 .

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  Oubliette

  TornInTwo: It seems to me that the GB used the illustration to promote themselves and to promote the preaching work of JWs, without clear scriptural backing for either.

  Bingo!

  Let's review: It's a cult!

  
  
  
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  88

  Damned if they do, Damned if they don't

  by FusionTheism in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i see an attitude among some people here which is not very helpful.

  i can understand it, but still, it's not constructive or helpful.. if you condemn the society for not changing, but then you also condemn them when they do change in a positive way, what incentive or motive does that provide for the people at the society to ever want to change for the better?.

  also, what does that attitude look like to current witnesses who are having doubts?.

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  Oubliette

  FT,
  

  no I'm not going to spend my entire off day to provide you the exact page numbers of each change

  Not one of the points you made in your previous post is an accurate description of any of the "changes" made by the WT leadership. I asked you for two specific things and you "responded" with a dozen different things and failed to give both the exact quotations and a reference.

  Typical evasive bullshit. You're just like the GB. You give what appears to be an answer, but really isn't.
  

  BTW, if you ever find yourself in a Judicial Committee, I suggest you try demonstrating your "repentance" using the language the WTBTS uses when it "admits its mistakes." See how that works for you.