To have freedom defender of truth, I would argue that such space to move in more than one direction as it were must be available; else there is no choices or space to move possible. If one can do good in a universe whose physics allows for what corresponds to good, which is does, then it also allows for the opposite which is what we call bad. The universe itself cannot choose its own physics for obvious reasons but it simply does them as it were. So good and bad is simply part of how the universe works and these include natural disasters as well as the good stuff. A direct example of free will being curtailed by the lack of evil is not possible, as it does not happen in reality.
Seraphim23
JoinedPosts by Seraphim23
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
God protects some and not others in order to give hope and faith to others if they want it. It is not because God loves some more than others as all die in the end.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
Giordano I didn’t know it was my God. I wish someone had told me! Anyhow your reasoning is in error in my view as such an adjustment by God would also mean human behaviour would also adjust as well, and not for the better. Indestructible humans wouldn’t do much in terms of work because they wouldn’t really need to. Life would become very dull.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
What do you think would happen if God stepped in to prevent harm from every natural disaster?
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
defender of truth, its personal experience that leads me to this conclusion along with anecdotal reports from others.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
I guess I would define a natural disaster by the affect an exterior natural event has on people in terms of pain, suffering and death. So unless an earthquake actually affects for ill people, it isn’t a natural disaster. One could also include animals in this.
You state Caedes that natural disasters don’t have anything to do with free will. Well they do as I have explained.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
I accept the evolutionary sciences without any issue. Although I’m not saying the earth had earthquakes when it was first formed. I think the crust had to form before any possibility of earthquakes or other so called natural disasters.
The idea of divine intervention to prevent something is a slightly different question to how God made things in the first place. I actually think there are instances of intervention to prevent animals or people being harmed by natural disasters. However I think there has to be limits to how much this happens. The idea of a world where any and all bad was prevented from happening to people or animals might sound good, but the reality of such a world would not be desirable at all. Such a world would also entail preventing people or animals from doing anything bad. The only choices left would be one of no choice, as all would be forced to be good all the time like a robot.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
defender of truth, the answer is, that it is not that the world was made in a way that required earthquakes but that earthquakes are part of the world. Otherwise it is like asking why earthquakes were made in such a way that required the earth. The question itself assumes certain things that are not the case as yours does. It’s also a bit like asking why God created up and down when he could have only created up! If one is talking about a rope for example having an up and a down, it is obvious why the down cannot be taken away in favour of its up. Good and bad are part of one another in the same way as up and down are. So singling out earthquakes as somehow being separate, or an add-on from the requirements of earth is as ill founded as thinking a ropes down can be taken away from its up. If God cannot lie, then certain truths are true even for God.
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
I joined the conversation at this point!
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754
Theists, why does God allow suffering..
by The Quiet One in..specifically, the suffering of animals.
you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.
i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.
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Seraphim23
If you say so but throwing canards my way doesn’t constitute a valid response.