3rd W, Christians are not born as Christians, and Christ's enemies are not born as his enemies. A period of wait and see must exist in order for a judgment to take place. Christ is at the right hand of God. He is judging and ruling in the midst of his enemies. But he allows his enemies time to repent, and thus he waits until they show repentance or die in their state of enmity. He has not been waiting for a time when he would be authorized by God to go into action as King and to defeat his enemies. They are already being defeated and have been for centuries. Eventually they will suffer full punishment. As Colossians 2:15 and other texts clearly show, he is already "stripping the governments and the authorities bare, [exhibiting] them in open public as conquered, leading them in a triumphal procession." Frank
Posts by fjtoth
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1380The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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fjtoth
Auldsoul,
According to the Bible, Jesus has been ruling in the midst of his enemies ever since he received his authority. They have been a stool for his feet the entire time. Satan has no authority at all, and no capability beyond what he is allowed to have. Death is the absence of life, it is not a person and has never had authority.
Amen!
"He is at God’s right hand, for he went his way to heaven; and angels and authorities and powers were made subject to him." (1 Peter 3:22)
Who are the "authorities and powers" that were made accountable to him as his subjects? The answer is given in Colossians 2:14, 15: "He has taken it out of the way by nailing it to the torture stake. Stripping the governments and the authorities bare, he exhibited them in open public as conquered, leading them in a triumphal procession by means of it."
Christ sat at the right hand of God upon his ascension into heaven. Sitting implies he is at rest and has ceased from all further troubles and sufferings from his enemies. He has advanced to the highest possible personal dignity and sovereign power under God. Angels, authorities and powers have all been made subject to Jesus Christ. He has "all power in heaven and on earth" to give commands and to pronounce a final sentence. When he returns, his enemies will discover to their everlasting sorrow and shame that all through their lives they were living under his watchful eye and were being judged by him.
Frank
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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fjtoth
3rd W,
When did Jesus sit at God's right hand and when were his enemies made a stool for his feet?
1914? OR THE FIRST CENTURY?
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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fjtoth
3rd W,
You wrote:
How then did he receive more authority after he ascended to heaven as recorded at Daniel 7:13,14, ; Rev 12? ; Just where did he go to secure this kingly authority as recorded in Luke 19 if he already had 'all authority' shortly after his ressurection before his ascension to heaven?
I think your problem is that you're stuck with the WT mindset. The Society is so narcistically focussed that it sees Daniel being fulfilled in connection with itself instead of in connection with God's Son. The Society just can't see past the mirror to realize that Christ, not the WT Society, is the central issue in Christianity. AlanF has already answered your question several times. I'm amazed that you fail to comprehend his clear answers. For example, in his post #4713 he wrote:
"For this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every [other] name, so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father." (Philippians 2:9-11)
FrankBecause the passage in Philippians uses language virtually identical to that in Daniel 7:13, 14 to describe Jesus' exalted and supreme position as ruler over everything, how can these JW defenders explain that the events described in Daniel were not fulfilled shortly after Jesus' resurrection? Let them explain to their readers exactly how it is that the events described in Daniel, according to their view, were fulfilled beginning in 1914 rather than shortly after Jesus' resurrection.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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fjtoth
I don't believe every member of the GB to be evil.
- Only evil men would teach that the majority of hard-working, devoted Christians are not born again like they themselves are.
- Only evil men would deny that a "great crowd" of Christians are God's sons such as they themselves are.
- Only evil men would deny the Bible teaching that Jesus is the mediator between God and all men.
- Only evil men would claim immortality for themselves and deny it to the majority of Christians.
- Only evil men would forbid the majority of Christians from partaking in the Lord's evening meal.
- Only evil men would take away the freedom of Christians to attend other churches for weddings and funerals and for other reasons.
- Only evil men would lord themselves over others with designations such as "governing body" and "anointed remnant."
- Only evil men would create class distinctions among Christians such as publishers, temporary pioneers, regular pioneers, special pioneers, circuit overseers, district overseers, Bethelites, Governing Body, etc.
- Only evil men would prohibit women from serving in any meaningful role within the congregation while expecting them to do the bulk of the work in "field service."
- Only evil men would constantly prod the membership by means of literature, meetings and conventions to do ever more and more in the service of the organization, promoting an atmosphere where many feel their best is never good enough.
- Only evil men would suggest and even set dates for Armageddon and thereby urge the membership to abandon normal living, often resulting in the ruination of health and family life, as well as creating employment and financial hardships.
- Only evil men would teach members to believe that righteousness and salvation can be earned by devoted and loyal support of the organization's slavish programs.
- Only evil men would arrange for the keeping of meeting attendance and field service records as a gauge of an individual's spirituality.
- Only evil men would organizationally ban blood transfusions instead of letting this be a matter of conscience, thereby cruelly informing all members that they will be shunned by the organization if they accept a transfusion that might restore health following a life-threatening accident or illness.
- Only evil men would instruct parents to allow their own infants and children to die instead of allowing doctors to give them necessary blood transfusions.
- Only evil men would teach that the "congregation" of Matthew 18:17 is the body of elders.
- Only evil men would arrange for the holding of heresy trials and disciplinary hearings in secrecy from the rest of the congregation.
- Only evil men would be responsible for the withholding of information that would be helpful to persons who have been accused of wrongdoing.
- Only evil men would give orders for conducting heresy trials of members who have doubts or who think differently upon the Scriptures.
- Only evil men would define apostasy as against the organization instead of against God.
- Only evil men would be quick to disfellowship instead of making efforts to restore persons who have done something wrong.
- Only evil men would unnecessarily and abusively shun members for mere minor infractions such as smoking or not complying with the whimsical directives of elders, thereby causing personal and family turmoil that often results in immense guilt, shame, fear, depression, bitterness, hatred, and even murder and suicide.
- Only evil men would show favoritism by advising innocent victims to "leave it to Jehovah" instead of urging the elders to take decisive action to deal with some members who have been accused of harming the innocent.
- Only evil men would ignore or minimize clear evidence of child molestation and other abuses simply because only one witness is available to testify against the member accused of such serious wrongdoing.
- Only evil men would cover over and hide from the public certain facts that are damaging to the reputation of the JW organization.
- Only evil men would blatantly lie to the public by declaring to news media that members may leave the organization at any time, of their own free will and without any repercussions from the organization.
- Etc., etc.
Frank