Posts by DJS

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

JG,

We have already effectively addressed your latest erroneous and specious whine. Yes, I would bake a cake that said Happy 140 Watchtower if that was the service I provided. I would also clean their toilets if that is the service I provided. My personal feelings have nothing to do with it; you might try that (making life decisions based on rational thought and ethics rather than 'feelings'. It is a more highly evolved way to live).

Read the other posts; this has been covered. It is a specious, whiney ass meaningless emotional and reactionary argument that the courts, and I, couldn't care less about.

"For as ever much how wrong I believe the Watchtower is--there are just as many people who believe that gay marriage is just as wrong and don't want any part of it." Then don't marry a gay person. Or practice your hate inside your homes and your churches. It really is that simple.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

JG,

Specious and erroneous: They are not, once again, participating in a ceremony; they are providing their business related services for profit. Trying to manipulate language to further your objective has been determined by the courts to be illegal and irrelevant and by me to be bullshit.

There are a lot of practices and laws in the history of the US, based on your fathers and their fathers beliefs in the hateful god of the bible, that led to a lot of laws and persecution. Including forced sterilizations, bans against marriage between races, separate water fountains for blacks and whites, blacks having to ride in the back of the bus, etc. Once again your 'feelings' are not supported by the evidence. But keep on whining; you make our point better than we can.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

Dear god, now you are also a conspiracy theorist: "The problem is the gay agenda (much like the Society) is very shrewd in keeping things covered up. They allow NO dissent whatsoever. They preach tolerance, but only when it favors their position."

If, by 'agenda' you are referring to the desire to be treated equitably under the state and national laws in the same manner as you, me, Viv and everyone else I agree. If, by 'agenda' you mean how the leaders of a gay action committee (I am assuming they exist, but I have no knowledge nor expertise about whether it exists or how it functions), and their internal committee/group functions, then I would suggest their 'agenda' is no different that the 'agendas' of the KKK, NAACP, NCAA, UAW, the Methodist Church or any other group.

But you apparently know better than I of the inner workings of the gays and how they organize and act. Maybe you are more gay than you think, especially since you know their positions.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

Oh dear god, you are also and End-Of-Time X-tian R Wing fundie. The trifecta of hate. I would rather live for five minutes in a world full of decent people of all colors and persuasions that spend an eternity with the likes of you and those like you. Your 'morals' apparently include hating decent, kind, law abiding people for no other reason than an old book written thousands of years ago tells you that you should.

And as we have pointed out many times, the more religious an individual, state, region or country the more likely it is to be dysfunctional and 'immoral' based on your definition of it. Yet another argument for which you have no basis other than your 'feelings.'

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

Religion is a choice and it is also a protected class. It does not matter whether being gay is choice or genetics; the SCOTUS and regional courts do not consider that, as it is a religious issue - not a state issue. And neither should any of us.

Your 'morals,' as Cofty routinely points out, are based on a monstrous god with a practice of monstrous behaviors.

The biggest whiners I hear and see in society are the R Wing X-tian fundies who want to hold on to their hateful practices and society and the courts are not allowing them to do so. Continue whining X-tian fundies; I will consider it music to the ears.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

We don't really care that you view it is a moral case rather than a civil rights' case, and apparently neither does the SCOTUS and other courts. X-tian fundies and Libertarians you 'feel' and 'think' that their particular viewpoint transcends the US Constitution and decency and ethics, is delusional at best and hate-filled at worst.

But you remain entrenched and full of hate; you wear it so well. One day in the near future, these types of hateful actions towards gays by those thinking they have a legal, 'moral' (pardon me while I vomit), or philosophical (pardon me while I vomit) right will come to an end in the US and likely all of the W and industrialized nations. It is getting closer each day, and when that time comes - and when haters such as the X-tian R Wing fundies - are gone from the planet it will be an even better day.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

They are exactly the same issue. They only appear different to you because you want them to. The baker, florist and photographer are providing a for profit, commercial service available to the public. They are not being asked to 'partake' in religious services, only provide the services they are getting paid for to an event, which they certainly would do if it were a religious event.

They do not have the legal right to provide the service inside their building and then refuse to provide it outside based on discriminatory reasons. But I suppose you know more than the framers of the Constitution and all of the individuals who have interpreted it over the decades. We should be in awe.

Using your (again) completely wrong analogy a baker could sell a cake to a black person inside their bakery but would be legally protected to not take the cake to a black wedding reception. The courts have determined that your viewpoint is wrong, and they have consistently done so for decades.

It would be so much better for you and the other R Wing X-tian fundies to simply lose the hate, realize what type of country we live in (constitutional democracy based on utilitarian principles) and that your religious beliefs and practices end at this demarcation point. And that demarcation point is a very good thing.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

This case is about the same issue that the cases were about in the 1950s and 1960s during the Civil Rights movement, which is to uphold the US Constitution in not allowing discrimination in areas of interest to the state. Commerce is one of those areas. Your need to resurrect this OP when it was sleeping peacefully suggests that you need therapy.

Whether you are a right wing X-tian fundie, Libertarian, Muslim, Gay or Black, discriminating in the marketplace because of your religious, social or political views has been determined illegal by SCOTUS and the various regional courts, in their interpretation of the US Constitution, for decades. It just happens to be gay people's time to gain fairness and equity.

THAT is what this OP is about and THAT is what this social movement is about.

274

Indiana "Religious Freedom" (right to discriminate)

by Simon in

sickening to see the photo of the religious zealots all stood around the governor signing into law the right for people to discriminate against others (gay, lesbian, trans-gender) based purely on religious dogma.. if religious people want those freedoms then the can't have it both ways - they cannot complain if *they* are discriminated against.. "sorry, we don't like zionists, get out".

"oh, it's some special mass and you can't work your shift?

you're fired!"..

DJS

Couldn't help it, could you Junction Guy? I wondered when you were going to show up to spread your own particular brand of hate. You are completely wrong; the courts have determined that you are wrong and will continue to do so. The US Constitution, when it was penned, determined that you are wrong.

Your examples are wrong. The only people being sued are haters who are discriminating and violating the US Constitution as well as the individual laws protecting blacks, religious people, gays and others from begin discriminated AGAINST in commerce and business. Practice your own brand of X-tian hate inside the confines of your churches and homes. You do not have a legal right to practice your hate in the marketplace.

Born again bible believers also were the tip of the spear in hating and discriminating against blacks, so I will 'fix' your comments:

"The issue at stake in the cake bakery is not the fact that they refused to serve blacks, it is they refused to participate in a service that goes against their moral conscience. There are some businesses (fewer nowadays) that aren't willing to sacrifice their convictions for a quick buck, and this baker was one of them."

205

Hi Everyone. Answer to prayer countdown...

by Stumpy in

jw
friends

i've been lurking for about 3 months now and thought i'd better finally sign up.

you have all been an immense help to me as i have come to realize that this isn't the truth so i want to say a great big thank you!

what a crazy, emotional ride it is to finally face the truth about the doubts that i have carried for many years.

DJS

Stumpy,

Welcome! We probably all felt like fools when we discovered the Borg was nothing but another religion at best and a cult at worst. It was a very good lesson for me, however. I'm with EdenOne; you're screwed if your prayer is answered. You should have picked something that would never ever occur, such as a man asking for directions or a woman actually apologizing for something she did or said.