what can i add?
this says it all.. elder on stand is mute till prompted.. .
i guess i could encourage you to watch to the end and a guest commentary, lol..
Something just occurred to me...why aren't the WT lawyers yelling "objection!" at every other question the Commission asks?
Just speculating here, but if this hearing is anything like a "Grand Jury" or "Congressional Hearing" in the US, you cannot object.
https://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.
anyone know who this monty baker is?
i'm sure this guy will be able to tell the rc how things work behind the scenes without all the evasiveness, being that he is an "apostate".
Arguments in law sometimes fall on a simple strategy (to paraphrase):
If the facts are against you, use the law. If law is against you, use the facts. If both the law and facts are against you, discredit the victim and/or witnesses.
And, if everything else is failing, buy yourself an "expert witness" to muddy the waters.
richard dawkins has said frequently if we don't agree with religious or spiritual people we need to "insult them!
" tell their their out of their "fucking gourds!
" and make sure you really show them how stupid they are for believing in something they can't prove!".
I am an atheist. And, I can say that I am angry because we are spending a lot of our energy and time in this world on imaginary sky fairies rather than solving real world problems. I get it. Believing in God/Jesus/Allah, etc. makes you feel special and gives you hope and fills you with purpose. Fantastic. Keep your fantasy but stop visiting them on everyone else. We adults have work to do and we can longer afford to indulge you. Do you get it yet?
I am still stunned that theists don't get this. There are about 7 billion people in this world, with billions of them thinking just like you - i.e. "I have the true God/Religion/Book. I am special." Do you still don't understand the absurdity of it?
On a side note, I have never had to mock or ridicule a theist. All I have to do is ask "What do you believe and why do you believe it?". The material writes itself.
i am shocked that an expert would simply examine only the literature given to her by the organisation she was defending and simply accept it.
also the ease she has in making huge sweeping statements when comparing the jw's to all other international religious organisations simply undermines her professionalism.. i am also thoroughly shocked at her blatant, 'expert for hire', 'will defend anyone' apparent decision making, the organisation is responsible for covering up thousands of abuse victims by its own records, in australia alone!
never mind their judicial process being heartless and traumatic!.
"Expert witnesses" are a dime a dozen.
In the United States, it is possible to drag someone off the streets and certify him/her as an "expert witness" without any deep qualifications. I can get an "expert witness" to argue that the earth is flat. Hell, I can be an expert witness. In the US, the onus is on the Judge is to decide if they are qualified to be an "expert". Unfortunately, the judges typically do not do their homework to determine if the person is following the generally acceptable scientific consensus.
back again since about 10yrs ago.
last year attended the international convention in new orleans and was feeling some type of way afterwards.
went to a couple of meetings and then the thrill was gone.
Sweetp0985, like other posters, I empathize for those familiar feelings. For what is worth, here is what I do:
I spend all of the time (I would have spent in the Organization) refining my work/craft, learning about the Universe, making friends, being with someone I love, enjoying life, etc.? The one cure to that feeling is to go make new memories
Lastly, a long time ago, I used to get that feeling of "what if they're right?" (basically Pascal's wager). Here is how I deal with it - I DON"T CARE IF THEY ARE RIGHT. The God of the Bible they represent and their Organization is immoral. I'm better than their God. And, if he is exists, I'm good with the idea of dying knowing I had the moral high-ground.
even cnn has picked up the ongoing royal commission hearings.
i'm sitting back and eating popcorn for this one, it's like a dream come through.. http://edition.cnn.com/videos/world/2015/07/28/australia-jehovah-witness-sex-abuse-hannigan-lklv.cnn.
DATA-DOG - What happens if the GB try to spin this as a sign of the GT?
Using the 1975 debacle as a model, I can imagine a scenario. However, it relies on more and more scandals coming to light and more and more JWs knowing about them:
I can imagine a number of witnesses beginning to believe that the GT has started. I can imagine the GB creating more material about the GT, how to prepare for it, etc. and some fuzzy/non-committed statements (in order to have plausible-deniability later on) that the GT has started. Something like "While we cannot say the GT has started, JWs today are facing unprecedented persecution as prophesied..." blah, blah, blah. I doubt that they can put a solid stake in ground about the start of the GT without taking some major long-term risks.
I can imagine that the effects of "implying" the GT has started, at least for the short term, could lead to renewed interest and effort on the part of the members. And, I have no doubt the GB would ride that wave as far as it can take them.
yes, star trek impulse drive was click bait.
but this british designed engine has been compared to that.. interplanetary travel could be a step closer after scientists confirmed that an electromagnetic propulsion drive, which is fast enough to get to the moon in four hours, actually works.. .
the em drive was developed by the british inventor roger shawyer nearly 15 years ago but was ridiculed at the time as being scientifically impossible.. .
i posted this as a reply to another thread, but thought it deserved it's own thread to draw attention to this important moment in the day 2 testimony.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl4fobrocc8.
A number of posters have commented on the embarrassing and clumsy way the JW elders/representatives have presented themselves on these hearings. Totally agree. But I would argue that it wouldn't matter which elder they picked, GB member, Jesus, or God himself, etc. to provide testimony.
Their position is fundamentally absurd and immoral. When your position is indefensible it does not matter who presents it.
i posted this as a reply to another thread, but thought it deserved it's own thread to draw attention to this important moment in the day 2 testimony.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl4fobrocc8.
DATA-DOG - Poor bastard!! I feel sorry for him, I really do! He's a poor, ignorant man. He's a victim of abuse and doesn't know it. He's been thrown under the bus by his gurus!
I had a similar sentiment until I imagined him in a priest or cardinal uniform.
we all know the wt basis for disfellowshipping, (1 corinthians 5:9-13) 9 12 for what do i have to do with judging those outside?
do you not judge those inside, 13 while god judges those outside?
remove the wicked [man] from among yourselves.. if removing "the man" is a protection for the congregation and no police are called, what does it say about the witnesses view of the world?
cappytan, thanks for posting the video.
Wow! It's like Bowditch had to reboot after each question. His answers seem to boil down to "We don't care what happens outside of the congregation. You'll are bird food as far as we're concerned." The only thing missing was him standing up after his deposition, dropping the mic, and giving everyone "the finger" as he walked out.
