Posts by JoeSomebody

24

JW's and stuff

by JoeSomebody in

it appears as if this is a haven for those who hate the jehovah's witnesses.

if that is too tough of a stance, then this place is a haven for those who hate the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

many are apostates.

JoeSomebody

Good morning everybody

I thought I spend the hour looking over your responses. I should say that there are some very interesting words to read.

Stinkypants I am not an elder or servant. I am in good standing within the congregation. I am sure that I would be counciled for speaking with those who are considered apostates.

I think that you are wrong in your assumption that we hate the Witnesses, afterall many of us still have family that are JW's and we still love them. Also, as for hating the Governing Body, well I personally don't hate anyone but they do seem to lie to/mislead a lot of people. (If you'd like proof I'd love to share it with you)

I am glad that there is room for love in your heart. My words may have been strong. Should I call it "extreme disappointment" instead?

On another topic, please show me a couple of what you consider to be lies. One of the things I have noticed is that when people research about the JW's, WTBTS and GB, they seem to blow things out of proportion or they do not bring to light the entire context of what is being taught.

Warfare is a bit dramatic if you ask me. I personally only try to help people and not judge them like JWs do

That is good for you. But there are some who consider it a personal vendetta to "get the WT". And there are some who make it their mission in life to save as many JW's as they wish. Spiritual warfare.

What, and non-JWs aren't loving and caring and genuinely concerned for others? To be totally honest, I've met more caring people outside of the JWs. As a JW I saw a tremendous amount of judgemental, uncaring people. Now that I'm out, not a one of them (not even my parents) have been caring towards me, not even the elders. Oh, and why the wall? Many here are God fearing, God serving Christians, doesn't that put them on the right side of "the spiritual wall"?

Your reading something in my words that are just not there. I have met many outside the org that are caring individuals. I could honestly say that there are more outside the org than inside that are caring. That is because there are billions more people in the world. With your judgement of what my words intended to say, it may appear as if you are a very judgemental person and was overly critical of those who are JW's. Now that you are no longer associated with JW's, those who are do not care any less for you. I bet they love you just as much as you love them. I would think that your parents should keep in touch with you. But that is their choice. It is between them and God on how they treat you.

Nice quote, how about this:

"As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible"- Watchtower, 1928 (So maybe Luke 17:2 was a mistake, hehehehehe)

What is the article talking about?

Big Tex, you said, "I don't like labels, so referring to me as an apostate puts us at a distance and makes genuine conversation more difficult.

I am sorry you feel this way. In all reality, since I teach a different gospel than mainstream Christianity, I am an apostate as well. Does this make things on an even footing?

I am pleased that you recognize the faults of your organization as it shows an open mind.

Humans are not perfect. We make mistakes and judge in error.

But you need to also recognize a rule that has been maintained and upheld time and again that is pure evil. That rule is the requirement for a victim (whether child or adult) of incest and/or sexual abuse to have two eyewitnesses (preferably baptized Jehovah's Witnesses in good standing) to confirm the abuse to the body of elders. Surely you must recognize that this places an impossible burden on a victim and allows what is arguably the most evil and hideous type of person, a pedophile, to walk free and continue to rape and brutalize innocents

Anybody who preys on children is an evil person. I have read about cases where the child (or adult) falsely accuses another. This "evil rule" is in place to protect those who are falsely accused. I will never defend one who preys on children. I pray that each and every one who does so will be judged according to his deeds.

The scripture you quote certainly applies to this rule and in all candor the people Jesus is referring to is not just the pedophile, but the men in Brooklyn who are have knowledge of the impact on victims and yet do nothing. This is more than simple human imperfection. This is evil incarnate. And if "imperfect men" on the Governing Body are capable of this level of human indifference to daily atrocities then the "truth" is not in them.

The "men in Brooklyn" may know about the pedophiles, but that is not saying that they are doing nothing about them. They stand by Bible council. It you are opposed to the Bible council, what does that say about your faith in the word of God?

When I was baptized in 1974 I swore allegiance to God and his son, Jesus. I did not then, and will not, be loyal to any human organization. I cannot conceive of any way in which Jehovah's Witnesses are approved of by the God I was taught about.

This is your decision. If you feel good about it, then that is your choice.

Agapeministry you said, You used both names-didn't you?

No, JoeSombody is my nickname for this message board. I am Gary.

I didn't know that there were apostates on this forum.??!!!!! So far, I haven't seen where any body is trying to lead people away from God or Jesus~~~Did You see that? Oh!! I guess you mean apostates of the WT. Well, I still haven't read where anybody tore downthe WT other than to mention several of their mistakes. How many times do you think they should predict the end of times before they get it right?

There are several ways to respond to your message. It all that is mentioned is a "few of their mistakes" and nobody wishes to lead people away from God, then why is this forum here? Let me ask you this question. How many Born Again Christians are hoping for an explosion in the middle east and who are helping it happen? Is this a potential prophesy in the making?

Or how many times do you think they need to make mistakes in telling people what kind of sex they can have causing thousands of divorces and then after all of those divorces say "They can't be the Master of the brothers/sisters faith? Or as far as that goes-how many mistakes do they get to make about any aspect of our lifes before they're held accountable? Like not going to college etc. that the end if just around the corner or forbidding to marry and not having children because the end is near. Did you know that it is against the Bible to do such things? 1Tim4:1-3

Do you realize that what you bring out is council. It is up to the reader to take the council or not. What is their goal? To serve Jehovah. To help others serve Jehovah. Going to college, marriage, children. Is it wrong for another to not go to college, not to marry, not to have children and to be a minister to God? As for sex, the GB gives council. It you agree, so be it. If you disagree, so be it. Just as long as you and your wife/husband agree that what you do is in agreement with council with Gods word.

I must go. I will continue later

Gary

24

JW's and stuff

by JoeSomebody in

it appears as if this is a haven for those who hate the jehovah's witnesses.

if that is too tough of a stance, then this place is a haven for those who hate the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

many are apostates.

JoeSomebody

I wish to thank you all for the comments. I will respond to all of the accordingly.

Hybridous, you said"I hope you are ready to deal with the fact that that millstone will end up around the neck of WT leadership. Good luck. Don't dismiss the truth just because it's not what you wanted to hear."

Is it a fact that a millstone will end up around the neck of "WT leadership"? Which leadership are you talking about? Jesus? Governing Body? Elders and Servants? Do you know thier heart? David did some very evil things and he was forgiven. If the "WT leadership" has done some evil things, if they are repentant, could it be that they may be forgiven?

What kind of truth may be hard to hear are you talking about?

1975? I was too young to remember 1975, but with talking to my mother and many others who were around back then, people were looking forward to 6000 years of human existance as maybe the end of the system of things. Who would not? Any person who claims to be a Christian looks forward to some sort of trip to heaven/end of the system of things/entering paradise. But, as my mother related, everybody knew that many prophesies had not come to pass.

The 607/1914 controversy? When I was first taught this, I did not care too much about it. It was not something that effected my standing before God. As far as I know, it has been a controversy since 1983. While the FDS may, as the saying goes, serve food at the proper time, it is still up to the individual to research it to make sure that it is truth. I know of many who do not believe this to be a vital point in our Christian faith.

Outoftheorg, I do not believe in luck. When trying to keep ones faith clean of "pagan" influences, what would you say the best way to go about it? I remember when I was a kid a bunch of people who claimed to be born again were all fussing about the protor and gamble stars and moon sign. They had a movement among thier churches (not all went to the same church) to boycott P&G products. Is this the proper way to conduct oneselves in order to maintain congregation purity?

Kenneson, the WT society has stumbled many. In what way? In what way did they stumble you in particlar?

Funchback, I was almost peeing my pants. Well, not really. But you were pretty funny. As for your quote. I have a quote for you.

"Poo Poo is like a box of chocolate. No, really, It is!"

Skeptically Yours, you said, "Under the 'Friends' forum, read the "You will never grow old" thread, started by Elsewhere. Then, dare tell me our wonderfully organized Watchtower Society is "The truth"

This I will do. I have to wonder, though. If one is resurrected, to heaven or earth, will that person grow old?

I happen to be one of those that's just in there because I can't emotionally afford to lose the wonderful relationship I currently have with my parents and some pretty nice fun people I've known all my life and just happen to be witnesses as well. You know what happens to disfellowshipped and/or disassociated people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So the little game must go on for many of us.

So, you are a JW because you do not wish to lose relationships with family and friends. I would advise you to consentrate on your relationship with God and everything else will be added. God will not forget you if you keep Him first.

As for disfellowshipping/disassociation. They are shunned. Some people, in my opinion, may take it a bit far. If they feel they need to shun family members rather than help them, then they are making Christianity and God look rather bad. I have always felt that those who need help should get help. Shunning has its place if done correctly. Everybody needs to make sure that what they are doing brings glory to God.

Granted I like the general theology of the religion, like a little opium for the mind, they have cried 'wolf' one too many times to have my respect anymore. And the 5 weekly meetings are so redundant! I keep hoping that the 'new light' will reveal that we're intelligent adults and that perhaps 3 or even 2 meetings per week is good enough.

I think crying wolf has been done throughout the history of Christianity. I do not have much to say about how bored you are at the meetings. Some people like them. Some people are bored.

Ed. Thank you for your input.

"Jesus may have been directing this warning at the religious leaders who taught their converts their own hypocritical ways. (see Matt 23:15) They were peretrating an evil system. A person who teaches others has a solemn responsibilty (James 3:1) Like physicials, a teacher should keep this ancient oath in mind: "First, do no harm"." Commentary from NIV Life Application Bible on Luke 17:1-3

Looks like others have the same opinion. But then, opinions are just that.

Gary

13

Questions to ponder - Apostacy

by JoeSomebody in

a couple questions came to mind as i read some posts.

i know many of you are not jw's any longer.

my definition is one that abandons the true worship of jehovah both in action and word, inside and outside the congregation.

JoeSomebody

Hi all! A couple questions came to mind as I read some posts. I know many of you are not JW's any longer. My definition is one that abandons the true worship of Jehovah both in action and word, inside and outside the congregation. I agree with the definition and scriptures cited in the Reasoning book and believe them to be Bible based.

1) What is apostasy?

2) What is the biblical advice to those who encounter apostates within the congregation?

Gary

24

JW's and stuff

by JoeSomebody in

it appears as if this is a haven for those who hate the jehovah's witnesses.

if that is too tough of a stance, then this place is a haven for those who hate the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

many are apostates.

JoeSomebody

Hello to all here

It appears as if this is a haven for those who hate the Jehovah's Witnesses. If that is too tough of a stance, then this place is a haven for those who hate the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. Many are apostates. Some are informed ones that were never Jehovah's Witnesses.

It has been a long time since I have regularly conversed with apostates and those who wage spiritual warfare (or whose ministry is toward Jehovah's Witnesses) against Jehovah's People. I think the last time were my years when Prodigy was the hot thing. My mother and I had fun coversing, learning and meeting many wonderful people.

In my years as one of Jehovah's Witnesses, I have come acrossed many loving and caring people who have genuine concern for those who are a part of this world and do not wish to see them on the other side of the spiritual wall.

From the experiences on this message board, there are some who seem to be loving a caring people but are wolves in sheeps clothing. Some in positions of responsibility. It saddens me that they are still considered Jehovah's Witnesses. It angers me that these people have stumbled thier victims out of the truth. May Jesus guide them.

Luke 17:2
It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were thrown into the sea, than that he would cause one of these little ones to stumble.

I hope I will have more fun conversing with many here.

Gary