Posts by Zoos

13

CHRISTIANS: Are we meant to identify the last days?

by Zoos in

i've been reading articles from ronald e. frye's, the christian respondent.

he puts forward this understanding of mark 13, mathew 24 and luke 21:.

(1) the destruction of jerusalem is set forth in graphic detail.

Zoos

God would not include prophecies in the holy writ unless He wanted people to read them and not fear them or be caught unawares when they come to pass.

I see your point, but it is all so subjective with each party claiming truth. It has become humanly impossible to legitimately lay claim to absolute accuracy - ESPECIALLY when you start quoting Revelation with all it's imagery.

For the sake of argument, let's assume that every understanding of prophesy you just mentioned above is wrong. When the prophesies begin to be fulfilled in some other way, it will constitute an "aha!" moment for us, but not necessarily catch us off guard or fearfull... because we knew SOMETHING was coming.

I believe the argument the author was making is that Jesus gave prophesies about his second coming that could reasonable be applied to every generation that has lived over the last 2000 years, having the affect of keeping every generation sharp and on it's toes. He reasons that THAT was the purpose of the prophesy - not the actual, factual, absolutist identification of a pinpoint in time.

In your earlier post you said: Jesus used prophecy to show the people that God knew all things from the beginning and to show them the signs of his [second] coming, which all the prophets looked forward to.

But the information provided could be broadly applied by several generations... and he knew it.

83

WATCHTOWER IN A PANIC!

by JW GoneBad in

jws are in need of more kingdom halls in many major u.s. cities.

at this years agm where it is expected that most of the faithful will be able to listen to the meeting (being tied in by video), dont be surprised if the wts 8 gb members take part in a symposium delivering some long winded appeal, petition, plea, proposal, proposition, solicitation or otherwise hit-on the masses for $$$ in order to lighten the burden and overuse that many kingdom halls are experiencing.

an acquaintance from the west coast mentioned to me that in late august thru early september of this year that a number of pow-wows involving close to 5,000 elders from numerous areas (riverside, los angeles, ventura and orange counties) took place to drum up financial support from the 800+ (not sure) congregations in those areas.

Zoos

At this years’ AGM where IT IS EXPECTED that most of the faithful will be able to listen to the meeting (being tied in by video), DON'T BE SURPRISED IF...

They have certainly taught us how to word our predictions.

13

CHRISTIANS: Are we meant to identify the last days?

by Zoos in

i've been reading articles from ronald e. frye's, the christian respondent.

he puts forward this understanding of mark 13, mathew 24 and luke 21:.

(1) the destruction of jerusalem is set forth in graphic detail.

Zoos

I should have clarified that I was not trying to figure out bible prophesy. I've become content to leave prophesy to history - sort it out later. I was just wondering if Jesus was telling us we HAD to look for sign x,y,z in order to "stay awake," and if so, what part of it is about Jerusalem and what part of it was about the last days or was it all a mishmash.

Thanks for all the responses. Bobcat, you gave me plenty of reading material to sift through. Thank you.

13

CHRISTIANS: Are we meant to identify the last days?

by Zoos in

i've been reading articles from ronald e. frye's, the christian respondent.

he puts forward this understanding of mark 13, mathew 24 and luke 21:.

(1) the destruction of jerusalem is set forth in graphic detail.

Zoos

I've been reading articles from Ronald E. Frye's, The Christian Respondent. He puts forward this understanding of Mark 13, Mathew 24 and Luke 21:

(1) The destruction of Jerusalem is set forth in graphic detail. The disciples are plainly told what events would accompany this and what they should do to protect themselves and avoid getting caught in that destruction.

(2) The matter of the Lord's coming or parousia is uncertain as to time and would overtake the world and the disciples at a time they would not expect.

Frye concludes that we were not intended to identify the last days but rather we were to simply be watchful that we not let our Godly devotion slip. Okay, that all makes sense. But my question arises in verses 15-28. Where do we draw the line between Jesus discussing the destruction of Jerusalem and his second coming? Do you think the prophesy about Jerusalem’s destruction is supposed to have a “greater fulfillment” in the last days – as put forward by the WT? I really don’t think there were false Messiah’s running around producing great signs and omens right before the destruction of Jerusalem. But, maybe there were.

If Christ's answer to his disciples was referring to two separate events at two periods in time, then where do we draw that line in his response?

If Christ’s answer is to be understood as having related signs and fulfillments in both time periods (and events) then His answer is very specific in a couple of areas – for example the “desolating sacrilege standing in the holy place.”

What are your thoughts?

30

Did a householder at the door ever cause you doubts

by perfect1 in

recently on a saturday morning there was a knock on my door.

two ladies asked me if i was familiar with the jws.

i said: yes unfortunatley.

Zoos

No. I considered any "defeat" as my own lack of preperation and study. Without question, I had the truth. It said so right there in the Watchtower.

I'm nobody's fool.

21

This website finally helped me understand the claim of 100% failure rate

by ILoveTTATT in

jw
friends

up to about 5 minutes ago... i still had the notion that maybe jw's predicted something and got it right... that the league of nations was going to rise and become the united nations.

i think that jw prophecies/predictions are like a shotgun: shoots many projectiles, one of them has got to hit.

you cannot predict 5 different things and then, when one of them gets partly fulfilled, drop the other 4.5 things, change the 1/2 thing you predicted that was right and make it seem like that was the only thing you predicted, and make the entire one point fit after the fact.. reading watchtower literature throughout the years (1879 till now), and then coming here and getting awesome explanations from people like leolaia and other researchers, i finally understand the claim that most apostate websites make: the wt has a 100% prediction failure rate.. they were lucky that something big happened in 1914... but now i am much wiser and i know that everything they predicted for 1914 did not turn out as they predicted... 1914 has been a date with many different hats... from the start of armageddon, to the beginning of the last days... etc.... thank you very much jwn for completely opening my mind.

Zoos

I use the SEARCH engine on this site more than anywhere else. There's a ton of great stuff here to sift through.

There's also a lot of caca on the floor, so be sure to wear your boots.

50

Gorby's father collapses at home after new light watchtower study

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

friends,.

sunday my father, a strong believing witness, former elder and still a ms, collapses at home after the new light watchtower study.. the cause was extreme stress.

i asked him about his worries.

Zoos

Be with your father.

45

OMG Have you seen this?? This site is sooo hysterical. It reminds me of The Onion, but for exJW's

by noni1974 in

jw
friends

http://jehovahstrumpet.com.

i read the cat baptisim article and i doubled over laughing.

one time when i was a kid i asked why my kitty couldn't go to the kh with us and my mom told me that animals were perfect and didn't need to go to the kh.. .

Zoos

Those stories can't be for real. There's no mention of Andre.

16

Don't Question. Don't Think. Just Obey!

by Oubliette in

some of the rhetoric in recent wt magazines got me thinking, it would be useful to have a somewhat comprehensive list of quotes showing the wtbts's incessasant control-freakery and their irrational--and apparently growing--paranoia.

i was thinking it would be good to have a variety of both longer and shorter, older as well as more recent quotes that prove the pattern and history of their manipulative mantra of: don't question.

just obey!.

Zoos

bookmarked

20

This WT book allows one raised as a JW to do a critical review of the religion and elders can't go against it.

by EndofMysteries in

i love this gem, it was taken off the jw.org website, it seems only material after 1990 is up now, but it's here, http://www.scribd.com/doc/5472988/the-time-for-true-submission-to-god .

page 6, "the need to search for the truth".

says this....and i couldn't agree with it more!

Zoos

Nice find.

Booklet was copyrighted in 1982. I was baptized in 81. I don't remember this booklet.

... just thinking outloud.