Posts by willyloman

28

WTS Controlling Tactics Similar to Phillip Garrido's on Jaycee Dugard ........

by flipper in

jw
friends

........ and of course, that should come as no big surprise considering phillip and nancy garrido were jehovah's witnesses either before, or quite possibly at the time they abducted & kidnapped jaycee and stole her life away for 18 years.

i will share some excerpts from jaycee dugard's new book " a stolen life " and see if you also identify similar mind control tactics garrido used on jaycee that the wt society uses on 7 million members.. notice this quote from jaycee about schools and education , " i, however, have mixed feelings about high school.

on the one hand, for eighteen years i had been taught ( by garrido ) that schools are bad and kids learn bad things there and peer pressure can ruin a child's life forever ; but when i consider who i heard all this stuff from, a kidnapper, rapist, pedophile, narcissistic, pervert, i can only come to one conclusion.

willyloman

Thanks, flipper, for pointing out the similarities...which are revealling.

Reading the comments here I was surprised that the Garrido/JW connection was news to some. Another (earlier) thread on this forum contains interesting links if anyone wants to do more research. The LA Times and the SF Chronicle are among the major news organizations that first brought to light the following facts.

1. Nancy G was a JW who met Phillip G while she was visiting an imprisoned relative. During her visits, she struck up a conversation w PG and he showed interest. The news reports are sketchy on the details, but those of us who were long-time JWs know what all this means. She either conducted a prison study with him or arranged for a male publisher to do so... but either way, she maintained contact because as we all know they eventually married.

2. PG got out of prison in large part because he convinced authorities he was a JW and a changed man. The official writing the parole report on him deemed PG to no longer be a threat. This, after serving 10 years of a 50 year sentence for raping a 21 dealer he kidnapped at Tahoe and held hostage in a stor-all unit he had converted to a torture cell. She escaped, he was arrested. This chilling, premeditated incident foretold his future entrapment of poor Jaycee.

3. Whether PG ever got baptized is unclear. But NG has been identified as a JW in numerous news accounts, including the recent ABC news special hosted by Diane Sawyer. The Garridos continued to espouse fringe religious philosophy even though news accounts are unclear how long he went to the local KH after parole. And news accounts don't specify whether she continued going to the Hall without him, or for how long. But when PG was arrested, he was applying for a permit to proseltyze on a college campus (as JWs do regularly) and distribute religious tracts (which were written and printed by PG). This public "witnessing" and tract distribution has a familiar ring to it, and we can all guess where he learned it.

12

Just checking in to let people know how I'm doing.

by JonathanH in

jw
friends

i haven't been around lately on account of having been very busy the past few weeks, and it's only going to get busier.

this place gives me a needed sense of community, so i thought i would just check in to let everyone know what i've been up to.. one thing i've been up to is matriculating.

i'm officially enrolled in college now, and my first day will be august 15. i haven't decided for certain on my major, but my advisor said that it's my first semester so not to worry too much about it, i'm just going through general college education for now anyway.

willyloman

Jonathan, congratulations on a smart move. In addition to learning a marketable skill, college will teach you critical thinking and the ability to see different points of view. It will also thrust you into the social lives of all sorts of people and teach you much about human nature. It will smooth all the rough corners you acquired in your dub life. And when you've completed the course, the sense of achievement is something no one can take from you.

It does seem like a long journey starting out, but learn the wisdom of Confucius: "A journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step."

57

The Real Issues Facing former Jehovah's Witnesses

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

on internet forums such as these, it is to be expected that there will be people who want to save jw's.

esp from (thinking for) themselves.. however, the real dillema's facing an ex jw who leaves, whether on their own terms or being disfellowshipped are real and haven't changed.. .

lonliness, how to make friends, is a big issue.. fear, esp fear based on superstition, a fear of god and of the future that is not in any way based in proveable fact.. education, how to think and reason critically to avoid being taken advantage of is a big challenge.. love, sex, and how to navigate your way around all of that hot mess.. geez, yeah, forgot.

willyloman

As a JW for nearly 30 years, I often had the nagging feeling that some of what I professed to believe was not quite true, or at least not exclusively true. The list of these things continued to grow but I was, like so many others, held captive by fear - fear of losing family and friends, fear of admitting I'd been wrong all those years. This kept me going to the KH for at least 10 years after I had an epiphany and realized the "truth" was largely false.

It was finding this forum back in 2002 that took away the fear. Here were people just like me, or at least a lot like me, who had the same doubts and fears and overcame them. They showed me that life after the WT was not only possible, but could in fact be a better life. In 2003 I found the courage to map out an exit. I meant to do it slowly and deliberately and started by confiding in my wife and grown children. I was surprised to learn they'd been waiting for me to say something for quite awhile. Their reaction ran the gamut from "I'm going with you" to "I understand and I may decide to go with you but I'd like think about it and in the meantime I will never shun you."

That was all we needed to hear and, in a flash, we were gone. Just walked away. Our offspring came along one at a time, and a year later were all out.

We have found freedom. We don't have all the answers; indeed, we don't even all have the same answers! But we also have no regrets. It's been a lovely path to be on and we are so grateful to so many of you - who helped us along the way without even realizing what you'd done.

82

Watching the Leadership Crumble

by Damn The Watchtower in

jw
friends

i watch the watchtower leaders crumble, slowly crumble.

one nonsensical move after the other.

you have no idea how this makes me feel.

willyloman

Page 2 of this thread contains what is probably the best stuff ever written on the subject of why people leave the WT.

68

Car Full of JW's while I'm at the Car Wash............

by Terry in

i'm sort of angry right now.. no, not angry..... i'm shaky.

at least, when i lift my cup of coffee to my lips, sitting here at starbucks, my hand is trembly.. i hate that!.

the power they have to still reach me on some hidden point that hides in the corners of my very being.... .

willyloman

On the other hand, you could have stopped him at the start, said "no thanks" and walked away. But you'd have felt bad for missing an opportunity to leave a mark. By following your instinct to be polite and truthful you made quite an impression, believe me. I attribute my own decision to leave the dub fold to things people said that made me think. If one of the five in that car has a brain and some lingering doubts, they will not soon forget what you said.

Did you say everything you wish you'd said, exactly the way you wished you had? Of course not. But you were you, and the you that you are now is a decent, compassionate human being on an incredible spiritual journey. They can't take that away from you.

32

I spend a few hours in rehab...

by Terry in

he was recruited, sort of, when his church (unity) was queried if they had somebody who could.

god is love.

feel love instead of hate for that person who wronged you.

willyloman

This "experience" made my day. The journey out of dubdom is truly enlightening....

21

Has there been a change on how JW's view those that have drifted away?

by lonestar63 in

jw
friends

i wonder if an article in the wt came out telling them to reach out to those that have drifted away.

i suspect the defection has been great in the last few years, and they're trying to bring some back.

i've told my story here, how i was able to succesfully fade away along with my family, without being df'd.

willyloman

In a social organization where the concept of disfellowshipping is universally upheld and supported, the people are predisposed to shun any member whose actions suggest a falling out with group-think. Many of them will be proactive and initiate the process without waiting for a formal announcement.

42

Long Call With Elder: Doesn't Know About "Generations/Overlapping"

by daringhart13 in

jw
friends

i had a call with a good buddy......still an elder the other night.. when i mentioned generations/overlapping.......he had no clue what i was talking about.

such a good man.......... but it doesn't matter.....they don't even realize what is being said to them; what is being done to them.

a high stature elder in their organization....and he had no clue there was another change..... how the hell does this happen?.

willyloman

They don't like thinking at any level.

Band said it best. That's so true. Two examples of many I could share:

Working with a guy in FS in about 1998. Between doors, he complained about how few were out in FS on Saturdays lately, that they seemed to have lost their zeal. I told him others had noticed it too, and attributed it to the "generation change" that appeared in the WT. He gave me a blank look. I explained that with the change in interpretation, the generation was no longer tied to the year 1914 and that the WT explained it refers to any group of people living in the last days. Since that came out, I said, it seems a lot of publishers have lost their sense of urgency and appear to be pacing themselves. He was quiet for a while as we walked. Then he asked when that information came out. He was shocked when I told him it had been 3 years. He said he had never heard this before! This was a fourth generation dub and ministerial servant, whose father and older brothers are all elders.

Second example: There was a part on blood transfusions on the service meeting and the PO assigned it to a guy who was a poor speaker who never did any research. The PO in my congo knew I was up to date on the WTS' current stance on this topic (because of my secular job at a local hospital), so I was surprised not be be assigned the part. When the speaker delivered it, I sat furious for the entire 20 minutes. All of his information was 15 years old. He didn't mention any of the recent exceptions or developments that had been approved for use by the Society. He gave the wrong impression by 180 degrees on what the latest Watchtower instructions were with regard to blood loss and medical treatment. His theme was along these lines: "No blood. Period. Take blood and Jehovah will kill you." Afterwards, I approached the PO and asked him what we should do about the misinformation that had just been delivered. He just looked at me and said, "I thought he did okay." I said, "Everything he said from the minute he opened his mouth was wrong, according to what the WTS now teaches. His ignorance could cost someone's life." He said, "Well, I didn't see it that way and, besides, it was good information for the friends to hear."

20

David Splane's Eternal Torment

by Damn The Watchtower in

jw
friends

david splane not only believes in eternal torment, he practices it.. in our 2010 dvd, jehovah's witnesses faith in action, part 1: out of darkness , br.

splane said this starting at 14:16, "he (russell) could never reconcile the teaching of eternal torment with the description of the bible of a loving god.

as he examined the creeds of the great churches when he saw that they taught that the wicked are tormented eternally, why, he just could not accept that.

willyloman

The main reason there will be no mass crisis of conscience, thus no reform, among JW leadership is that these men are haughty. They unflinchingly refer to themselves as "glorious ones" and "princes" over the earth. They demand honor (as opposed to earning it). And they get really, really pissed off when they are disrespected by other dubs - especially when they are called out on their shortcomings.

That's why worst pain you can inflict on an elder is treat him as if his opinion has no weight and his position is meaningless. They just hate that.

81

Samuel Herd a Murderer?

by Damn The Watchtower in

jw
friends

hello folks,.

i feel like a fish who has been struggling for oxygen so long he's almost dead.

time to grow some legs and get the hell out of hell.

willyloman

DtheW: Your first post is a doozy, thanks for coming aboard and starting what's become a fascinating discussion.

I was an elder for more than 20 years, my wife and children all pioneered. We were "serious" JWs. What we got for our faith (in the WT) and our "integrity" was the slow, sad realization that hypocrisy and corruption were running rampant throughout the organization. In good conscience, we had to leave. And all six of us did.

A poster, above, shared this scripture, which led me to a fresh realization:

19 They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us. But [they went out] that it might be shown up that not all are of our sort. 20 And YOU have an anointing from the holy one; all of YOU have knowledge. 21 I write YOU, not because YOU do not know the truth, but because YOU know it, and because no lie originates with the truth.22 Who is the liar if it is not the one that denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one that denies the Father and the Son.

As I read that, it dawned on me that we didn't leave them. They left us. I'm sure many here feel the same way, even though each one's journey is different and we've all come to be unique spiritually.