Viviane

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Posts by Viviane

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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  I submit this:

  1) It is possible that something is going on that we are not fully capable of grasping.

  2) If something is going on that we are not fully capable of grasping then it would be wrong to reach firm conclusions based upon only things we are capable of grasping.

  However, you are attempting to reach a firm conclusion based upon only that which we fully understand. For us to reach a right conclusion we MUST therefore presuppose that we understand everything.

  I believe that this is a flawed presupposition.

  But... if there is something we don't know and we also don't know that we can't know it, how could someone ever be expected to wait to make decisions based on that lack of knowledge about a lacking understanding what we lack knowledge of to make a decision? How could we ever hope to know what we don't know we don't know and, even if we did, couldn't understand?

  That seems like a "god of the gaps" argument to me.

  I am learning a lot about constructing a logically valid argument from this thread. And the meaning of the word "obfuscation".
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  Tammy, my questions were simple and you didn't all address them. You talked about them, but not much more. It's clear now that you will NOT directly answer, so there is no point in even trying a conversation with you.

  Thanks, though. I learned something today, so that's always a plus.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  Maybe if you went point for point in the post you found confusin, and then highlight exactly what I was confusing on... I might understand better what to clarify?

  No, I will not do that, that's simply a rathole factory that drags everyone into where everything gets lost in pages of pages of drivel. The confusion about what you wrote is because I don't understand what point you are trying to make, it's too disjointed.

  If you could just answer the questions. Summarize your main points with supporting information, that should be enough. Questions repeated:

  Should we NOT pray for others? Just for God's will to happen? Should we pray and just HOPE that it's God's will? You said we shouldn't pray for ourselves, but Cornelius did just that.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  Thanks for your reply, Tec. I still really don't understand what you are trying to say, but thanks for trying. If you could maybe summarize, list your point with supporting info that might help. I don't mean this critically, but your writing style is very hard to follow and you don't seem to be making points, it seems disjointed and little all over the place.

  Maybe it's just me. Thanks, though.
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  21

  Fish With Feet

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/jan/13/tiktaalik-fossil-fish-four-legged-land-animal.

  had gills and lungs, too.. can you say 'missing link'?.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Ernest, I am quite well acquainted with the fossil record, thanks though, for others that might not be.

  My question was about that, you missed the point. Your initial statement was that there was not enough information to be precise, yet you are making very precise statements, such as that Tiktaalik is a link to nothing. How can you possibly say that paleontolotist don't have enough information to be precise YET claim it's lineage went nowhere? It seems you are saying "we don't know enough to say what happened, and we know this because we know what happened". Also, your point abut Romer's gap doesn't really stand as it ran from about ~360 milion - 340 years ago and Acanthostega appeared about 365 million years ago, so you REALLY can't say whether or not it's line went anywhere, thank's to Romer's gap (which you brought up).

  That is what I am asking you to clarify. It seems to me that anyone claiming that because we lack information and can't make a definitive statement by making a definitive statement about the VERY THING they are saying we don't know enough about is the one with no leg to stand on (unlike the fish).

  Wouldn't it be better to simply say "That's an interesting idea, but as yet we don't have enough information to support that definitively"?
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Viviane

  Vivianne we are talking about Gods love..if you have ever loved somone you will agree its a confusing subject.....

  How is letting people you love get hurt through no fault of their own when you have the power to stop it confusing? I was sayuing Tec's explanation of prayer was confusing, not love.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Viviane

  Could we sum up this way?

  Solomon, prior to Jesus, "The guilty sometimes get what they deserve and the good get what they don't, it's God's mystery"

  Today, Christians after Jesus, "Ditto, except Jesus died, so heaven. Oh, and you shouldn't expect anything from God."

  Tec, I read all of that and I can't figure out what you are saying? Should we NOT pray for others? Just for God's will to happen? Should we pray and just HOPE that it's God's will? You said we shouldn't pray for ourselves, but COrnelius did just that. This is very confusing to me.
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  21

  Fish With Feet

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/jan/13/tiktaalik-fossil-fish-four-legged-land-animal.

  had gills and lungs, too.. can you say 'missing link'?.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Can you please elaborate your question with examples as it is unclear to me what you are referring to.

  I am happy to.

  You wrote: If you are going to say 'missing link' then you will need to be more precise as to exactly how and when amphibians evolved tens of millions of years later. As it happens, this period is called Romer's gap because the fossil record is so sparse it is effectively non-existent.

  Then you wrote: In fact, the descendants of Tiktaalik, the Acanthostega, were completely wiped out so Tiktaalik was a missing-link to nothing.

  It just seems like you are saying we can't say precise things about millions of year ago by saying a precise thing about millions of years ago.
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  39

  Any Amateur Astronomers Out There?

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  i have recently revived my interest in the night sky.

  there are a lot of great sights you can identify with just a pair of binoculars.

  i am currently relearning how to navigate my way round all the constellations and find some of the best objects.. i live out in the country so we get almost total darkness right outside my front door.

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  Viviane

  I am. I have a Celestron Astromaster 114. I use Stellarium as my software. I love the moon, Mars and Jupiter. I am hoping to get a solar filter soon so I can observe the Sun. If you have an Android phone, there is an app called Night Sky Tools that is really nice to have, it has a night mode that puts everything in red to preserve your night vision.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  Adamah is the WT Anti-Type of Tec, it seems.

  Side note, JGnat, I have been reading a lot of your older posts, I saw a site you referenced, Coursera, it's awesome! I like a lot of your posts and threads.