lime05,
I remember those questions clearly. Those questions went a LONG way toward snapping me to my senses. I'm not peevish at you, but the Witness' responses have me a little peeved.
One person couldn’t live for hundreds of years obviously, therefore a class (or group) of people were required to dispense spiritual food over time. The “slave” then became responsible not only for ministering to the needs of the anointed body members but also for taking on the responsibility of preaching the good news of the established Kingdom to people of all nations. (Matt. 24:14)
Wonderful. So, explain why Matthew 24:14 or 24:45-47 or any other part of Matthew 24 indicates that this Slave would need to dispense food to anyone for two millenia.
And even if they can explain that (which they can't), the response fails to address the question: Is there SCRIPTURAL evidence (as opposed to interpretive and imagined historical proof) that the "faithful and discreet slave" is a class of people?
The organizations in the bible were spirit-directed, it talks of disciples praying to God.
Actually, OldSoul said he had no issue with individuals being spirit-directed. The Bible is full of examples of that. He said the organization is not spirit-directed. Think for a moment: If the organization of natural Israelites were actually directed by holy spirit, is it even possible for it to become corrupted? Can an organization pray to God?
But this is all built on their basic cracked premise that God has always had an organization and always will.
Oddly, they even say Jesus submitted to God's organization (as opposed to submitting to the Mosaic Law). The Pharisees, Sadducees, and Sanhedrin would be amazed to learn this. From their perspective, he was an apostate and a false Christ who was calling disciples after himself despite the policy of disfellowshipping anyone who confessed Jesus as Christ. (John 9:18-34) They didn't think he was submitting to God's organization.
The path of the righteous ones is like the bright light getting brighter and brighter until the day is clearly established. (misquoted from Proverbs 4:18)
This is interesting to me, because their entire defense of "new light" is based on a Scripture that refers at best to steadily more intense light. Actually, this Scripture doesn't contextually refer to organizational understanding at all and is clearly not prophetic of our day. It is a PROVERB.
Merriam-Webster defines PROVERB this way: a brief popular epigram or maxim : ADAGE
Here is the proverb in its entirety. I welcome your comments regarding whether it actually supports the concept of "new light" as being new organizational understanding of Scripture or doctrine.
Proverbs 4:14-19 — Into the path of the wicked ones do not enter, and do not walk straight on into the way of the bad ones. Shun it, do not pass along by it; turn aside from it, and pass along. For they do not sleep unless they do badness, and their sleep has been snatched away unless they cause someone to stumble. For they have fed themselves with the bread of wickedness, and the wine of acts of violence is what they drink. But the path of the righteous ones is like the bright light that is getting lighter and lighter until the day is firmly established. The way of the wicked ones is like the gloom; they have not known at what they keep stumbling.
In context, please explain how this supports doctrinal "new light" from a centralized earthly organization?
The Bible does not state the sheep are from different sources, The sheep are on the earth and refer to people of a teachable nature. All the sheep have the hope of living forever.
This is at very best a misrepresentation of facts, and at worst an outright lie. I feel confident in your friend's case it is simply ignorant misrepresentation. However, he or she has certainly been lied to. In the Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures (Wescott and Hort's text) published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society—as ostensible support of their New World Translation—literally translates John 10:16 this way:
John 10:16 (KIT) — And other sheep I am having which not is out of the fold this; and those it is necessary me to lead, and of the voice of me they will hear, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.
In other words, according to the Greek text they specifically have two sources and one destiny. Jehovah's Witnesses defy the sense of Jesus' words at their convenience to make it seem there is one source and two destinies. A thought which is entirely supported by their mistranslation of John 10:16.
John 10:16 (NWT) — "And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd."
Now, the way they translated it still could be perceived to be within the meaning of the actual Greek. But the way they apply it and teach it cannot. They stretched the Greek as far toward their dogma as possible and then stretched the already stretched English, too.
For a fun time, ask your friend to show you every Scripture in the New World Translation that uses the word "paradise" and invite him or her to teach you that it refers to earth using only the surrounding context of those verses. There are no two destinies in Scripture.
I invite any comments you may have on these matters. Specifically:
(1) does the Bible actively teach that the Faithful and Discreet Slave is a class or not?;
(2) does God's spirit operate on individuals or on organizations?;
(3) does Proverbs 4:14-19 teach that organizations will receive new doctrinal light over time?;
(4) does John 10:16 demonstrate one source for sheep with two destinies, or two sources for sheep with one hope?
and we'll add one, just for fun
(5) does the Bible teach that the word "paradise" refers to earth?
In other words, are these doctrines Scriptural or man-made? Which is the same as asking, are these from God or from false prophets? (1 John 4:1)
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
