Advice is to Beat the kids......still!

by Gill 61 Replies latest jw friends

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  Gill

  Hi Beep,Beep!

  The first thing that 'got right up my nose' about this article was the sentence:' the psalmist wrote of children who are born in honorable wedlock..' some of the nicest people I know are born OUT OF HONOURABLE WEDLOCK.

  The second problem, is it still sets physical punishment up as a piece of good godly advice.

  Physical discipline is NOT given by people in a calm and reasonable state, unless there is something, 'not quite right about them.' People, smack, hit, physically punish their children when they are feeling, frustrated, enraged and unbalanced. Usually, the thing they are smacking their child over is completely out of proportion to what the offence is - for example fidgeting through JW 'boring as hell' meetings.

  The WTBTS recommends smacking...FULL STOP.

  Smacking doesn't work. In general, it does more harm than good. It is rarely given calmly. It creates fear. Fear does not allow learning, it causes the 'switching off' and 'panic' responses. You don't learn much when 'switched off or panicing.'

  I would agree that talking to children educates them.
• 

  one bad apple

  One of my best jw friends father was Minisrtry servant. he was a bi product of 70's(did a lot of drugs) and wa CRAZY. He would beat my friend and her brother constantly. he was obsessed with any beat your child scripture. when my girlfriend was 13 he pulled down her pants and spanked her on a the side of a busy road. A real sicko. I believe he was hiding behind the religion.
• 

  Gill

  one bad apple - power corrupts, and some parents, it corrupts absolutely.
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  Brigid

  You mean, Beep Beep, the Society has never actually put anything in writing that says "beat your kids"?!?!?! That my experience and so many others was just a fluke perpetrated by congregations full of renegade witnesses throughout the Southwest US? Boy do I feel silly now! Thanks for clarifying my whole life.
  I just wonder how in the heck they could've gotten it so wrong, even up to the late 90's (as I was still being admonished to corporally punish MY INFANT). Hey, I wonder if one could actually find in writing where the Society actually stated that 1975 was the end and they should do whatever they could (even selling their houses) to further the preaching work. You know, I'm not sure they did. How, then did a whole religion full of people go nuts around 1975 as the Society obviously does nothing to textually promote such craziness?
  Wow, you've really opened my eyes, Beep Beep---I'm gonna go cgoogle something really quick...hold on
  Hey, did you know that the Catholic Church has nothing in writing that condones or sanctions their pedophilia amongst their priests? They in fact, do not ALLOW their priests to have sex of any kind! So, I wonder how could there then be a culture set up or allowed to fester that allowed such atrocities? Curious...I'm glad the WTBTS gave the Catholic Church the forgiveness it deserved.
  Look, Beep Beep, Mark, or whoever you are...I'm not sure why you chose my story to attack. I'm glad you have such a fulfilling love peace and harmony experience within the organization.....Great! I've never wanted to "Take down the organization" I've always tried to be respectful to witnesses even anonymously via this forum. I even help out my family who is still in financially because I now have the means to do so (I help them with no strings attached---if they want to drop the cash right in the Cont box, that's fine!). I honor everyone's right to follow their path. But I despise child abuse in any form from any religion from any person. And I despise mendacity and I include in that, history revision.
  So, one more time:
  The abuse was common.
  The abuse was tacitly sanctioned.
  The abuse was culturally encouraged.
  
  Peace,
  ~Brigid
  

  
  
  
  
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  Beep,Beep

  Hey, I'm sorry you feel like I attacked you or your story. I did nothing of the sort,however. I merely presented my observations which have just as much relevance as your's do. Your story does not automatically make mine wrong.

  Culturally encouraged abuse? I don't think so!

  Culturally encouraged DISCIPLINE? Well here in the U.S. spanking certainly was openly condoned by the general population up to about 25 years or so. I can certainly remember kids in the neighborhood telling me how their mom or dad gave them a good smack on the ass. I received a couple myself. I deserved them. But abuse? Nope.
• 

  Gill

  Hi Beep,Beep!

  You have a good point. Kids did receive a spank on their bottoms for being naughty.

  WTBTS instructed discipline for wriggling, crying, making noise and disturbing 'vital life saving instruction from Jehovah' at the Kingdom Hall.

  I have seen a tiny little girl of about a year smacked to the point of fitting in a KH toilet. Her mother was 'normally' a lovely woman. I think she was driven to 'attacking' that tiny child by the 'fear of Jehovah'. 'Armageddon', 'bad things happening in the future to her child if it didn't remain a good JW' etc.

  Disturbing a meeting and being bored and crying and wriggling, are not good enough reasons for a spank, never mind a beating.

  Just ask how many people here have been taken to the toilets, hallway, or mothers room for a beating.

  The beatings are born from the parents fears and frustrations, not from a child being naughty.

  That's the difference....even if you do wish to argue that society has condoned a spank up until recently. On that point I agree with you.
• 

  Brigid

  <<But abuse? Nope>>

  Abuse, Yes.

  Culturally encouraged.

  Tacitly sanctioned.

  Glad your experience was better than so so many others. You got off very very very lucky.

  Love and light to you, beep beep...

  ~Brigid
• 

  BlessedStar

  The second, is 'Actually the Bible is against violence and abuse of any sort.' What?! The God of the Jews was condoning slaughter of young and old all through the OT. People were stoned to death for cheeking their elders etc.

  I'm afraid the WTBTS is still into child beating.

  Spanking a child means not spearing the rod. Abuse is something totally different. Who can't hear would feel. It worked long ago and it will still work if it is applied correctly.

  The bible never talked about abusing the child. When someone rides a horse why do they use whips? Wouldn't that be cruelty to animals.

  In your ideal sexual encounters, why does some fetishisms indulge in whippings?

  See how silly this sounds?

  Blessed Star
• 

  Gill

  Blessedstar - NO! I don't agree. In fetishess you have two people agreeing.

  Most kids don't agree with a beating.

  Spanking is proven not to work. You cannot apply a 'correct' beating.
• 

  BlessedStar

  Spanking is proven not to work. You cannot apply a 'correct' beating.

  You use the word beating.

  You beat a mat, but you can spank a child. It is a form of punishment. Children respond to various forms of punishment - not all children are the same, not all grow up in the same type of environment.

  If you continually say "No" to a toddler for e.g. hitting the baby, and the toddler keeps on hitting the baby, an automatic response is to give that toddler a little slap on the hand with a firm "No!"

  Don't tell me you never spanked a child or an animal. Abusing and beating is different.

  Blessed Star.