Comeback from witness...interesting

integ

Hi,

I asked my Uncle elder about the scripture that says; "Keep testing to make sure you are in the faith" or something to that effect, to kind of try to explain why I have the audacity to question watchtower doctrine. His response was something I guess I knew, but had forgotten.."That doesn't mean to keep testing the teachings of the faithful slave, it means that we need to keep testing 'ourselves' to make sure WE are still faithful to Gods' organization".

I had forgotten the spin on that scripture, and all I could do was shake my head and say "okay, whatever". That's how hard it is to reason with these dummies sometimes.

-Integ.

mrsjones5

THey have an answer for everything...maybe an incredible stupid answer but it's still an answer.

Like beating your head against a wall, ain't it?

Josie

itsallgoodnow

Yeah, I've thought about that one, they can spin that in their favor. What about the Boreans, who researched whether "these things were so"?

vomit

I am at the same stage myself with my mother.
But all is not lost.
This is a better scripture you can use.

1 John 4:1

1 Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world.

Lady Liberty

integ,

The scripture is 1 John 4:1 - Interestingly if you continue reading on thru verse 6, the picture is clearer. The later half of verse 6 says' "This is how we take note of the inspired expression of truth and the inspired expression of error." The Watchtower doesn't claim to be inspired, so they say... thus they would be prone to errors. Therefore, doesn't it make sence that a true follower of Christ Jesus would follow the scriptures instructions? After all, what would it hurt?? If the Watchtower is in line with the Bible, shouldn't a thorough examaination just strenghten our faith? Unless of course, we were to find MAJOR flaws?? Acts 17:11 says, ".....for they recieved the word with the greatest eagernesss of mind, carefully examining the Scriptures daily as to wether these things were so." The Society likes to say those Beroeans that were doing the "examining", were unbelievers. So does that mean that once we become believers, we are never to "examine" what we are being taught? One way I have used to reason this same point out is, why would the Beroeans be told to "examine" Gods own inspired words, yet we cannot examine the Societies, who claim NOT to be inspired?? I doesn't make sence. If Jehovah God himself was not offended that these ones would question his faithful ones who were dispencing this "food" back then, then why would he be offended if we question, or "examine" the things taught by the Watchtower who are NOT inspired? Again, a thorough examination should only be faith strengthening if we were being taught Bible truths.

Anyway, thought my 2 cents may help you somehow!

moomanchu

If they know and are confident that they have the truth,

why are they scared to discuss questions about their truth?

It reminds me of an accused criminal

who doesn't take the witness stand to defend himself.

If I was innocent of something you couldn't keep me from

talking about it. If I was OJ maybe I'm would just plead the

fith.

Scully

*** Rbi8 2 Corinthians 13:5 ***

5

Keep testing whether YOU are in the faith, keep proving what YOU yourselves are.

Ok, I can see this scripture applying to the individual claiming to be a Christian. However, how does a JW get around this one:

***

Rbi8 1 John 4:1-3 ***

4

Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world.

2

YOU gain the knowledge of the inspired expression from God by this: Every inspired expression that confesses Jesus Christ as having come in the flesh originates with God, 3 but every inspired expression that does not confess Jesus does not originate with God. Furthermore, this is the antichrist’s [inspired expression] which YOU have heard was coming, and now it is already in the world.

The WTS has had a very bad habit for at least 30 years, of putting itself in the chain of salvation, and expecting people to be in association with The Faithful And Discreet Slave™ / WTS in order to gain salvation, rather than having faith in Jesus. According to 1John 4:1-3, then, whenever the WTS requires its followers to follow the mandates of the WTS rather than Jesus, it is proving that it does not originate with God. In fact, by drawing people away from following Jesus, and drawing followers to itself, the WTS is actually committing apostasy.

Even the WTS recognizes this to be true:

***

w86 7/15 p. 19 Go On Living as Children of God ***

Be

on Guard!

19

John next shows how we must be on guard. (Read 1 John 4:1.) We must not believe every spirit, or "inspired expression," but we should "test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God." Why? "Because many false prophets have gone forth into the world." At least some of these deceptive teachers were then traveling about, associating with various congregations, and seeking to "draw away the disciples after themselves." (Acts 20:29, 30; 2 John 7) So the faithful needed to be on guard.

moggy lover

Actually, I think the WTS goofed on this one.[2Cor 13:5] If they advise the "OS" to keep testing themselves then they've got the wrong group. Why?

Because, the ones who are advised to do this "testing" are the ones who will "live TOGETHER with him" [2 Cor 13:4] Last time I checked, these were only the "disjointed anointed" It Is THEY who should be doing the testing, not the poor saps who follow them.

Ironically, as Ray Franz points out in COC, many GB members actually disagree with several doctrines of the WTS. I'm pretty sure that I read that the late Albert Schroeder was a maverick in this regard. So in fact these are the ones who would fail the test!!

Cheers

mdb

Some of these have been posted, but that's okay. Scully, what is the Rbi8 bible? The wording is a lot different than the NKJV below (eg. "inspired expressions" seems new age in contrast to "the spirits" and the ideas portrayed are vastly different between the two.)

Test Everything
Test all things; hold fast what is good. 1 Thess 5:21

Search out the Scriptures
These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so. Acts 17:11

Examine ourselvesExamine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified. 2 Cor 13:5

Test the SpiritsBeloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world. 1 Jn 4:1-3

purplesofa

great reasoning Lady Liberty

One way I have used to reason this same point out is, why would the Beroeans be told to "examine" Gods own inspired words, yet we cannot examine the Societies, who claim NOT to be inspired?? I doesn't make sence. If Jehovah God himself was not offended that these ones would question his faithful ones who were dispencing this "food" back then, then why would he be offended if we question, or "examine" the things taught by the Watchtower who are NOT inspired?

purps

Comeback from witness...interesting

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