well i had a phone convo this morning with my mum whos lovely but tried to steer the conversation to JWs again.. she said I dedicated my life to jehovah and not the wts, well ive got all of sick of lies commities on my ipod and have been listening to them as i commute and while at work, i know em word for word almost. and when the 'no nice way to leave, wheres my contract' section came up the elder said 'you did have a contract', basically saying that when you say yes to the 2 quetions you enter a verbal contract, the elder said 'the question (to the effect of) do you dedicate your life to jehovah and his earthly spirit directed organisation. with this in mind i told my mum (mom for the yanks) the above and she disagreed. SOO.. can anyone tell me word for word what the questions are, it goes something like- Question 1.... pause... question 2 ... pause then 'your loud affirmative answers prove you are wready and willing blah blah blah' does saying this at the end make it a verbal contract like its your time too speak up if you object. hmm this is interesting like sick of lies said 'what if i dont remember does that nullify it' love your work SOL you did great. I think youll be famous in the apostate community for a long time, who knows maybe youll start a trend.
convo with mum- dedication to jah or WTS
by heretic 11 Replies latest jw friends
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VM44
Here is an article about the revision of the Babtism Vows. --VM44
The Watchtower Society's "New Light" On What Baptism Means
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VM44
From the article:
The newest baptismal questions were set forth in the June 1, 1985 (p. 30) Watchtower:
(1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
(2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?
Note how different the second vow is from the earlier versions. The Society has managed to get newer members to, in effect, join a worldly club from which their membership can be terminated at any time by the Society (disfellowshipping) while at the same time convincing these newcomers that they have only dedicated themselves to their Creator. Can any actions be more devious?
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What-A-Coincidence
yeah...it's dedication to Jehovah through the WTS ... Jehovah never approved of that arrangement. So thus those 2 questions that were asked were never approved to be given to one at baptsism by jehovah thus it is null in my book.
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Bonnie_Clyde
I was baptized in 1956 and my dedication was only to Jehovah and his son. They still have a way to get around it. My continued assocation with his earthy organization indicated that I was dedicated to it.
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Honesty
I was baptised into the 'spirit directed' organization in 1990.
I terminated my contract with the Jehovah's Witnesses in 2004 and became a free man.
I was baptised as a Christian in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit in 2005.
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jwfacts
Read her question 2 and then read her Mat 28:18 where is says to baptise in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, and then ask where the word organisation comes from, and which JWs need to get baptised to something beyond what Jesus commanded.
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heretic
thanks guys thanks very much for your input. this is a very interesting little point isnt it, im gonna tell my mum for sure, I think itl get her thinking. she set herself up for this one and its gonna be a sweet KO. Ill just put it out there and let it fester mwwahahahahaah (evil laugh)
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jwfacts
Here are other scriptures on baptism that you can read her, again none talk about being identified with an organisation.
(Acts 2:38) 38
Peter [said] to them: "Repent, and let each one of YOU be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for forgiveness of YOUR sins, and YOU will receive the free gift of the holy spirit.This next one is really mind bending for a JW as it shows that you need to be baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit, not a spirit directed organisation.
(Acts 8:14-17) 14
When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Sa·mar´i·a had accepted the word of God, they dispatched Peter and John to them; 15 and these went down and prayed for them to get holy spirit. 16 For it had not yet fallen upon any one of them, but they had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 17 Then they went laying their hands upon them, and they began to receive holy spirit. -
heretic
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/113726/1.ashx
Ok ive had 2nd convo heres the link