A Friend Needs Advice and Help--NOW!!!!

by whyizit 24 Replies latest jw friends

Wolfgirl

Here's the KISS thread:
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/55372/1.ashx
Sorry, I use FF, and it won't give me the buttons to make that clickable.
Honesty

She has to tread very carefully.
These questions may help or they could put her on his 'apostate' radar screen:
She read the following scriptures in several different bible translations and it is troublesome to her:
Luke 24:45-48 (KJV) Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.
Luke 24:45-48 (NWT)Then he opened up their minds fully to grasp the meaning of the Scriptures, and he said to them: "In this way it is written that the Christ would suffer and rise from among the dead on the third day, and on the basis of his name repentance for forgiveness of sins would be preached in all the nations—starting out from Jerusalem, YOU are to be witnesses of these things.
Matt 4:17 (KJV) From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Matthew 4:17 (NWT)From that time on Jesus commenced preaching and saying: "Repent, YOU people, for the kingdom of the heavens has drawn near."

What is the Good News that Jesus' disciples preached in the first century and beyond?

What does the bible say the Good News is?

What is the Good News that the Jehovah's Witnesses preach today?

Is the Good News that the JW's preach the same Good News that was preached in the first century by Christians?

What does the bible have to say about anyone who preaches a different Good News than the Good News of the bible?
jgnat

He’s panicking and hoping to bully his wife in to coming back in to the fold. That’s why the ultimatum, that’s why he is insisting she do so this weekend.
Panicked JW’s can’t hear.
She has to have him in a receptive state of mind first. Otherwise, he may make more ultimatums or even demand a separation.
If she wants to go the honesty route, if I were her I’d keep the literature tucked away. Later, when he is more receptive, she can leave the information out in folders for him to find. This is a much safer way of informing your partner of how SOLID your evidence is, without embarrassing him.
If she goes with the honesty route, I think she should turn some questions on him.
1. WHY NOW, does he HAVE TO KNOW? Can’t she have some time to carefully consider her position?
2. Is he AFRAID OF LOSING HIS FAMILY?
3. Does he honestly want to know how deep her doubts has gone, does he really want to split up his family now?
4. Does he honestly believe there is ANY EVIDENCE that would convince him that the WTBTS does NOT HAVE THE TRUTH?
5. If he would NEVER BELIEVE ANYHOW, why should she bother telling him? He’ll just disbelieve her anyhow.
IF HE IS ABLE TO ADMIT there are a few things that would convince him the WTBTS doesn’t have the truth, she can follow his lead and tell him what she’s found. BASED ON WHAT HIS ISSUES ARE.
anewme

I was not successful in getting my zealous husband to get off my back about the many meeting attendance and field service requirements he set for our family.

I felt as an aging adult I had the right to decide a more limited involvement due to my changing health circumstances and mood swings I was going through. I had put in 35 years of faithful service and it was time to slow down and grow and smell some roses I felt.

But NO!!! The devil was making inroads into my thinking he claimed!!!

Looking back I should have just come out and warned him I would leave and divorce him if he didnt back off and leave me alone on this one and serve Jehovah at his own zealous pace.
But I didnt and he wouldnt quit. Nightly we had arguments in bed from 3am-5am. It was just dreadful.

I loved him so much, but he just drove me away with his JW fanatic cult zeal.

I had no children so it was easier to walk away.
jwfacts

I am reading Combatting Cult Mind Control by Steven Hassan, and he makes the point that in groups like JWs the mind is trained to close as soon as it is confronted. I have found the same every time I have discussed doctrine with JWs of any suggestion that it is not the Truth.

I would recommend she says very little before reading that book and doing more research so that she is very familiar with why it is wrong.

The way to get through to a person in such a group is to find out what it would take to prove the WTS is wrong. Then research that area and discuss it at a later date.

Also get the person to think about what they would be doing if not a JW. Get them to realise that there are many groups that are the same.

I would suggest your friend make clear that she will not be a JW and will not be going back to meetings under any circumstance. Then let him do all the talking to find out exactly what he believes, why etc, so she can prepare to discuss the correct things for his needs at a later date.

In asking others what made them leave I came up with a list of about 30 different reasons. Until she can work out what is important to him she can not know what it will be to wake him up.
anewme

Her JW husband does not know any other way to live or be. If she gives away her power over her own life she is doomed to fail to win her freedom. She must not play into his game.
I suggest she comment that this weekend is not the right time for HER to discuss this topic.

She must help him to envision another life style, another marriage where the wife does her own thing.
He may be threatened by the change in her attitudes. She needs to help him know that she loves him and the children but that her zeal has changed towards aspects of the religion.

What is HE going to do about it? He cannot divorce her for merely missing meetings or refusing F.S.

He must understand he cannot force her to serve Jehovah like the WBTS dictates.

She must not be bullied into saying statements that will get her DFd. She must remain very centered on what is good for her at this time and wait out this storm.
anewme

Oh this reminded me of when I tried to put my foot down about meetings, my husband insisted we pre-study the Watchtower together on Saturday evenings (so he could be sure I was ingesting the spiritual food). He conducted it like a regular meeting with each of us taking turns in reading and answering. OMG! He even insisted our study last an entire hour! Im grateful he didnt make me stand and sing afterwards!!!
Dont get me wrong. Im all for a zealous couple studying together. But when one is seriously wanting a break is not the time to crunch down on them with more control and threats of destruction at Harmageddon.
He treated me like a bad child or a bad slave.....or bad dog! He just yanked my choke chain!!!

I would never stand for that abusive mistreatment now.

I say put your foot down and stand your ground and be ready for the fight of your life and your marriage.
bythesea

Some clarification, since this is ME we're discussing here!!
Hubby DOES know other ways to live, we were not always JWs...I was baptized in 82 and he in 88...we came out of the "hippie" generation and while our lifestyle was not full of "sex, drugs and rock n roll" at the time we studied, he still feels that if not for studying the Bible he wouldn't have made a good husband and our marriage probably wouldn't have made it. We have always had a much freer relationship than many couples in the WTS, probably due to the fact that I am a strong independent person, not reliant on my husband for too much in terms of approval..but then I never asked for too much that was out of line. He has stated recently that I wouldn't WANT him not to be a JW, that it wouldn't be good for either one of us...I guess that means he thinks he'd turn into a drunken sot if he wasn't a JW??? He seems to feel it is what keeps the reins on him....
I have avoided having a discussion with him about my feelings about the WTS for over a year now...I really don't think it can continue to be avoided!! He deserves to know what's going on with me and why...I understand the cognitive dissinance deal, I've been facing it when we have tried to talk during the past year! Attempts to discuss things ends up being an emotional trauma for us both! But, how does this get resolved if not by finally CALMLY sitting down together and picking it all apart? He knows I go online, he knows I'm in touch with people online, he knows I've read CofC and other books...he knows I am dreadfully afraid of losing my kids over this whole deal... He is just soooo sure that it IS "the truth" because he feels the Bible has proved to him that it is...as interpreted by the JWs, of course!! He has a whole long list of things he can spout as to why they, and only they, are the true religion.
I don't know if any of this helps, but I figure I have about another 2 hours(West coast time) to figure out what to say to him when he gets home!! Any and all comments are appreciated and taken into consideration! Thanks!!
mckay

I don't think anyone has an obligation to prove the cult is wrong. The cult has the obligation to prove it self true. If I were leaving a cult I think I would explain that the evidence provided to prove it's self true has failed to convince me and further solid evidence is required. Until then I remain unconvinced.
mckay
PS A person doesn't decide to either believe or not believe in a cult or a religion, that comes automatically with the knowledge that is gained or provided. I can't decide one day to start believing in my parent's Mormon religion, I know it's a load of manure. If the facts are lacking then the choice is already made.
bythesea

Thanks McKay, you make a good point!
Among the books I've read is the one called "Captives of a Concept" by Cameron...he zeros in on the JWs being chosen by Christ in 1919 to be his channel of communication...the whole FDS thing and Matt. 24:45. Because I know the arguement and can tear that whole idea apart using their own literature, does anyone think that might be a place to start in trying to e xplain why the whole thing doesn't make sense to me anymore?? I don't know how any JW can defend against what was REALLY going on with the JWs at that time in their history....
There are so many good statements people have made to me here...I am just confused as to which direction I should turn...but I don't think I can get by any further with silence on this...and he deserves to understand why I want out, even if he doesn't agree with me! We've been married over 30 years, he's been a very good husband and mate...I don't want to continue to drive a wedge between us on this issue of religion!

A Friend Needs Advice and Help--NOW!!!!

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