A question for those with faith (page 2)

DHL

I've gone the other way, DHL. I've concluded that God does not intervene in some cases because he CANNOT.

jgnat, IMHO if there's a god/Maker then he can do anything with what he created. A god can never be limited. Otherwise he wouldn't be GOD!

I also disagree that ALL SUFFERING is bad. There is such a thing as short term pain for long term gain. Take perms or tattoos, for instance.

I strongly agree with you on this one, jgnat, as you can see from my first post (you beat me with that one).

I just wonder which part god plays in this scenario. I think we are either responsible for ourselves and deal with lifes inconveniences or we can go whining to god about the things that happen that we don't like and ask for his intervention.

Isn't it the basic question here if everything in life has to be fair? Does existing on planet earth automatically include having enough to eat, drink, a safe and clean environment and so on?

How's about Charles Darwin who insisted that only the strongest would survive?

jgnat

I've had a few "divine intervention" instances lately. Or perhaps it's just "happy coincidence". For instance, my daughter was offered the house adjoining mine before it went on the market, at a reduced price. I sense God's hand, though I didn't specifically pray for more time with my granddaughter. Not that I'm complaining! I sense a plan shaping, and I'm happy to go along.

I don't think it's response to whining in a case like this.

Or how about when I was in total despair, a beaten woman, I called out to God, "What do I do?" and He answered. In an audible voice, He gave me a phone number. That call was the pivotal act in my escape from my first husband.

Now, God intervened IN THAT CASE. I don't want to dismiss instances when God apparently DID NOT ANSWER. I can't say why or how He chooses. I have no idea why.

sass_my_frass

Thank you everybody for answering with dignity a question I asked in a tipsy stupor. I'm not sure where I stand on the faith scale but have currently settled on a scenario in which God is a highly distant and incomprehensible force powerful enough to work through creative improbabilities but not very interested in the welfare of it's creation.

I do wonder why Athiests ask questions about good and bad. On what basis does an athiest determine what is good?

That's a good question, but an atheist would need to answer it.. still we grew up in countries which have a highly defined legal system and in absence of a god, that would probably be the higher authority that found it's way into their conscience. Helping = good; hurting or stealing = bad.

There's nothing especially wrong in my life at this time besides the shunning; my question wasn't so much about me than about economic inequity, drought, violence.... yesterday I got an email from a lady on the Fijian island that Mr Frass and I were working on last year installing some wind and solar gear, and it reminded me of all the women there; good passive wives entirely enslaved to their husbands and elders and the hybrid communist-methodist-monarchist governance that keeps them locked into it. "God is pleased when you work hard to give things to your elders". It really only applies to the women though; the men don't do anything that is tedious or non-creative or that doesn't make them look important, they prefer to blow their money on kava and be King Shyte of Turd Hill.

I've gotten into a bit of a depressive loop about the oil wars and the fact that you can distance yourself from it as much as you like, but as soon as a madman decides he wants to use a nuke, it's your problem too. I remembered a time I was arguing about Jehovah and Why Good Things Happen To Bad People when I was very fresh and hanging out with a guy I now realise was just trying to get into my pants. He couldn't because he wouldn't accept that Bad Things Happen To Good People because Satan is in charge of things on earth at this time, and Jehovahs going to fix things soon. He told me that I have a very lucky God; he gets the credit for the good stuff but is not responsible for the bad stuff. It was one of the many things that finally got me out of the cult.

I guess I now hover around the assumption that IfTheresAGod it doesn't care what we do, whether we put faith in it, who we hurt.... to be honest I don't think a creature that so wilfully destroys creation and itself is it's chosen one.

JH

So, why do bad things happen to good people? Is God so great that It doesn't care?

Adam sinned, and everybody is paying for it, good and bad. From the bible.

God cares, but he shows it in a funny way. From me.

ballistic

Take a look at our universe. Only a small part of it is kind enough to have warmth to keep us alive and oxygen for us to breath. Most of it is just a vast vacume. And it is massive indeed by our standards. There is also nothing we can call godly in the universe. Even worse, there is no fairness. Fairness is something we try to impose on the world. Space is a deep dark place where life is hardly possible anywhere. And us humans have done our hardest to make some parts of this earth liveable. The rule of the universe is survival of the fitest. It's hard, it's cruel. It's the last thing you expect to find out, but it's true.

atypical

I like this quote:

Epicurus [341–270 B.C.] Greek philosopher

	"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"

jgnat

That sums up my dillemma quite well, atypical.

Sass, I don't get down on world events. What we hear is filtered information anyhow. When it comes to the human condition, I tend to observe at the micro level rather than the macro. What is the state of my family, my neighbours? In my circle, most people are good and try and do good. Those who do evil by ignorance are a scant ten percent, and those who do evil by design are puny 1%. I like to empower the good, and neuter the "evil by design".

Undecided

For example something that seems to be a bad thing might change into a good thing in the future.

This kind of reasoning doesn't work. There are too many things that don't change into a good thing in the future. And why would God inspire the words that, "sickness, sorry and death" would end if it could be a good thing for us to endure?

Sorry, I didn't notice the question was for those with faith.

Ken P.

DHL

Maybe not everything bad will change into something good but looking back on my life so far I must state that it weren't the good things that had the biggest impact on me but the pain that I've gone through. I've learned the most from my suffering and how I overcame it. It taught me what is of importancet in my life and what not. As the old saying goes: "No pain no gain!"

I can also see this happening on a bigger scale: When things go wrong - like when we have a drought in Africa or a tsunami in Asia - that's when people start to give it an eye and try to solve the problem. If everything was fine with us and our environment all the time then mankind had no reason to move forward and learn. Life would be really boring without a reason to seek improvement, wouldn't it?

jw

So, why do bad things happen to good people?

God is here for us if we continue to ask for his help in prayer.

And he does not answer all our prayers but keep on asking any way!

Is God so great that It doesn't care?

Well sry but God does give conditional help.

Ya may not like that, but what is the alternative?

A question for those with faith

Share this