Jesus Perfect Man (page 2)

praiseband

Narkissos, Thank you for your insight. I have learned much from reading your posts. praiseband

hallelujah

Jesus claimed people were filled with demons. I deny that. If he said it, I deny him. (that's twice I've denied Jesus now)

Dan

gumby

Jesus claimed people were filled with demons. I deny that. If he said it, I deny him. (that's twice I've denied Jesus now)

*gets rooster ready*

hallelujah

Hi umby

I just posted my third denial and haven't heard the rooster yet. Maybe after I post it to the WTBTS

praiseband

Hallelujah, were you trying to make some kind of a point? You signed your name Dan. Is maybe your middle name Peter and I'm just not well enough acquainted with you to have known that?

I just this morning faxed my disassociation letter to the WTBTS and posted it on another thread today. But I had to make the point that I don't just reject the WTBTS, but the whole of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. Of course there are intelligent people within those movements over the aeons who have contributed something to humanity - but those additions to humanity have to be taken for their own value, not because they are in scripture or dogma.

There are many things in the bible attributed to Jesus which are great and useful and there are other things attributed to him which have proved fatal to later generations. On that basis I reject the perfection of the composite fictional and contradictory character in the Bible as my saviour.

As for the three times thing, it's strange but whenever I have a dip in the ocean in winter, I always make a point of going under three times, even though I'm not a christian, have not been baptised, and will not.

Dan

praiseband

Hallelujah, Thanks for your explanation, because I can understand you much better now. I liked the portion about dipping in the ocean because the ocean is my favorite place to be. Although, the water is not near warm enough where I visit, or calm enough, to be enjoyed much past your knees! To me it is a very restful and meditative place, and I am always so amazed by how just sitting there you can see the landscape changing minute by minute. I won't pretend to understand exactly how you feel about faith in general, because I do not have the same experiences you have had, but I do hope you will continue to seek the truth. I believe we all need to find our faith on our own journey, and I believe that if you really study you will find it. But one thing that can't be done is for people to demand that you believe what they do. I am a Biblical Christian. I have always been allowed, in fact encouraged, by my pastors and fellow Christians to study and dialogue about all kinds of interpretations of what I read. I have found that the more I have learned from other people's viewpoints the more I have grown in my faith. Not because I feel I must or I will be rejected by my church or family and friends, and not because I feel that I must protect my beliefs from the 'outside enemy'. But because I believe God wants us to use our brains and discern for ourselves what is true and what is not, and what is gray because what is right for one situation may not always be right in another. He wants us to learn through growth and anticipates us getting it wrong sometimes and right others. I would not describe Jesus as a Perfect Man, that is something I took from JW literature. I do believe he is the example that God placed before us to model ourselves after. That he is fully human and fully God in one. And I do believe that more than anything God wants us to learn to love him and other people unconditionally. But he allows us to do this of our own choosing, and not by force. Take care.

hallelujah

Thanks praiseband

Of course I over-reacted - I do not deny Jesus the man, in fact I undeny him. But I do deny what I consider to be the fraudulent writings about him in the bible. How can the two be reconciled when the evidence of Jesus existence is effectively the Bible? Well I consider that there must be some factual existence underlying the Gospels, i.e. that a man, Jesus preached to do good to others and was crucified for challenging authority. In that I stand for Jesus. However I do also believe that his story has been made into a composite God man by later writings, such as the imputation of virgin birth, rising from the dead, rising to heaven (which is widely assumed to mean flying physically upwards into the sky), asking everyone to eat his flesh and drink his blood. Who is to know what was said and what was later imputed to him by fraudulent writers. I have no right to deny him (if he existed as a man).

Dan

Jesus Perfect Man

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