Are We Missing the Bigger Picture???

drew sagan

We all pretty much have come to the same conclusion here that the Watchtower is a corrupt system that controlls it's followers. Through websites, tv, and books many have put in alot of time exposing the teachings for what they really are. But is there something going on in the organization right now that is even bigger than the false doctrines, something that shows they are in the planning stage of something that's even more corrupt than what is going on now?
I have started thinking about a few differant things going on in JW land and then it came to me all of a sudden.
They are changing this religion.
Remember too that change isn't allways a good thing. By change I don't mean they are making progess in fixing problems, instead it seems that there is a systematic change to alter the image and belief structure of what the Witnesses really are.
It all seems to have happened when they made the generation change in 95. Think about some of these facts:

- There is now a decades worth of new JWs that where never taught about the generation, or any other chronology based theory that puts God on a schedule
- Think about the publications used to convert new JWs. They are getting shorter and more generic. Less doctrine, less prophecy, more on family life and doctrine.
- Think about the structure of the meetings, even the Watchtower studies. They are more and more becoming 'moral' guidebooks, and less the radical Bible interpreatation they one where. The Bible distortion is still there, but everything is much more generic.

I can see a paradim shift from the old witnesses (pre 1990's) and the new ones. Newer ones have never been given any explanation for almost 95% of the Bible. From what I understand Witnesses used to have an opinion on everything, now they remain silent. I spent 7 years going to meetings and have never been taught what they belive about Eziekiel, Jeremiah, ore the 12 prophets (besides 20 minute convention parts and a terrible new 'the 12 prophets and morals book').
It seems though that witnesses from pre 90's have a grasp on many differant points that the Society teaches that the newer ones do not. And it dosn't seem to be linked to how long you are in the organization. It seems to be more about how they are changing what they teach at the meetings and in their books. They are going less and less into the Bible and it is becoming more and more suedo Bible study. Just writing whatever they want and supplying scriptures to back it up. It seems that back in the good old days they tried to explain it all, now they just ignore it all.
Does anybody see this? We are allready past 100 years of the Watchtower exsistance. It seems that every 25-30 years they change enough so that they are almost a new religion from where they where before. Think about just those who have become members in the past 10 years (myself included), we are a totally differant kind of memeber than those who converted in the 60's,70's, and 80's.
In another 10-20 years this will be and entirely new religion. Not new in what they teach, but how they present it, talk about it, and think about it. JWs are changing.
It's like the old frog and a pot of boiling water. Put the frog in while its boiling he jumps out, put it in while it is cold and raise the temp to boiling and the frog dosn't notice.
It's changing into something I think most witnesses 30-40 years ago would be angry about, but now they say nothing.
Does anybody else see this or am I just crazy?

drew sagan

I almost forgot to add a comment about the JR Brown conversation yesterday. Listen to how the man talks, it almost seems that through his speech you can see this kind of a change is on the move.
At least that's what i heard.

slimboyfat

Less on prophecy?

They have in recent years published in succession, books on Daniel, Isaiah and now the Minor Prophets, and they are also going to study the Revelation book again.

I agree there is dumbing down, and more emphasis on "Christian values" than on the "deep things of God", but I don't think we should overdo it - they still teach the wacky stuff too.

What they are really missing are innovations in the wacky-doctrine department. When Franz was around he had an abundance of weird ideas to draw upon, now the leadership seem to suffer from a collective lack of imagination on the doctrine front.

Slim

drew sagan

While it is true they have a push on the prophecy still it is much more 'dumbed down' than it was before. Also, from what I understand most people walked away from that Isaiah book study more confused than they went into it with. Those two books where so bad it almost looked as if they where ment to confuse on purpose.
I'm not trying to push a conspiracy theory, or say they are making a move to get rid of any crazy teaching, it just seems they are pushing them more and more to the backround. Even with a revelation book study people will walk away with not much gained other than obey the society.
Just a thought.

troubled mind

Drew I think you are on the right track . I was raised as a witness and see a big difference from the early 70's and what is taught now . The change of let's say the teaching atmosphere is because this truly is a man based religion and is influenced heavily by human cultural changes. I have expected big changes now that the older " anointed ones " are dieing off and their replacements have a totally different outlook on things .

jwfacts

I agree totally.

Armageddon obviously isnt coming, but they have removed all date references and generations teachings so they can not specifically be proven wrong.

There is now too much information for the WTS to claim any direction by Holy Spirit. Browns speach was an eye opener.

The doctrine has changed so often that now he openly admited "we are just bible students"
Holy Spirit is easily proved not to direct appointments (Cano case in point) so Brown tried to claim that HS directs them by following bible principles.

Blood transfusions have virtually become a conscience matter.

The only thing that really still identifies them as a cult is shunning, so it is yet to be seen what will happen with this. If shunning is done away with then this will become just another main stream religion. The sad thing is that instead of imploding the WTS will probably continue on indefinitely.

troubled mind

I'm not saying what they teach is so different , but how it is taught . I can not believe how elementary bible studies are now. We have been taught to ignore real indepth questions , just stick to the book.

Terry

I overheard a conversation, a brief one, the other day in the bookstore where I work. It was between a newbie JW convert and a bookseller who knew the person.

The gist of it points up the central tone of what becoming a Jehovah's Witness does for one's mental status.

It boils down to this.

The Watchtower Society has created a scenario which is not unlike a potboiler novel on the bestseller list.

The first time an "interested" person hears it they gulp and start asking for "proof".

Obligingly the sermon commences with a blur of flipping onion skin pages as the bible gets a thorough revamping. Random acts and quotes are strung together like an inevitable pearl necklace thrown to swine.

Here it is: the new and improved Watchtower Mythos!

We know the real story and everybody else has the lie. All of history is a giant conspiracy to hide the Truth. Our inside information about the real origins of Christmas, Easter, the Trinity, etc. proves we are God's chosen mouthpiece.

Sadly, this appeals to the ego. Knowing something the other fellow doesn't is a heady intoxicant! The Watchtower messege is like watching an elephant float in midair! The elephant is real enough, but; the wires doing the lifting cannot be detected.

Those "wires" which hold the elephant of historical malfeasance aloft are the connective arguments of the Watchtower which are just as silly and corrupt.

But, the trick is impressive and the audience gasps and applauds and goes out enthusiastically to tell their friends about REAL magic. What appeal the Jehovah's Witnesses have are threefold: 1. JW's present an impressive grasp of "Bible Knowledge" which is little more than a professional idoctrination not unlike watching a fourteen year old recite the Gettysburg Address. 2.Jehovah's Witnesses are brimming with self-confidence whereas the rank and file Christian flails about independantly depressed (not having the BIG PICTURE view of life) and without "meaningful purpose" (such as going door to door warning of THE END) 3.Jehovah's Witnesses have a time limit. They are under the gun. A sense of urgency pervades everything. (At least at first.) This gives them remarkable energy for fantasy fulfillment. In the long run (and it is a LOOOOOOONG RUN) it is exhausting and frustrating. But--at the beginning--it is a brisk marathon sprint across the imagined finish line. The reward dangles in front of them elusively but beckoningly. JW's are a package deal. They are a kit. Meeting one is like talking to a sports star. They are home-run hitters about to break a world record. The illusion of COMPETENCY and utter CONVICTION are quite appealing to a person driftin through life without enthusiasm.

jgnat

Slap me with a limp noodle, I agree with slimboyfat. This year's "new" release is on the minor prophets, and the Revelation book is being studied AGAIN next summer.

I don't think this ship going anywhere, it's sailing in circles. I blame it's (virtually indestructible) structure. The writing department is independent from the GB, but the GB holds copyright. The service department is independent again from the other two, but is nothing without the literature. Both the GB and the writing department depend on the service department for income.

I think the service department is going heavy towards morality (Ted Jaracz?) using the OT and Paul's writings, and skipping the gospels. The magazines similarly concentrate on JW behavior. So this is maybe what you are seeing, Drew Sagan.

The end-time prophecy stuff is concentrated at the book studies.

the dreamer dreaming

we are the TRUE snake oil sales people....look those other PHONEY snake oil sales people have ingredients in their snake oil

not found in the official snake oil cook book! they have made a poison that is most foul.... our snake oil is pure!

sure we have to constantly modify the claims we make for what the snake oil does and will do, but trust us, we are not tampering with the original ingrediants like those phoneys

Are We Missing the Bigger Picture???

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