BLOOD ON THEIR HANDS Twisting a life-affirming law into death

by Terry 80 Replies latest watchtower medical

• 

  Terry

  Turning a life affirming rule into a death-dealing policy is an amazing accomplishment. We can thank the Watchtower Society for a mindset which makes this possible.

  I've gone into great detail before about the Watchtower blood policy itself.

  It is a blatant and deliberate publicity stunt which takes the rather simple prohibitions of the Laws of Noah for Gentiles on murder

  (abstain from blood=do not murder)

  in order to paint Jehovah's Witnesses as Super Christian Martyrs. We can thank the contrarian tastes of Judge Rutherford and the macheivellian mind of Fred Franz for the resulting doctrine.

  The ethical question is simple, but, not simple-minded.

  Life only has value when it has purpose

  For ordinary humans self-preservation is the beginning of all other values.

  A dead person cannot worship a living god.

  When death becomes a valuable purpose it exposes a core insanity.

  The (Watchtower) blood policy turns this on its head. Abstaining from blood was life affirming to Christians and Jews in the 1st Century because it was a call for preserving human life by not shedding blood in murder. The Watchtower has diabolically reversed this into a death affirming policy by making martyrdom more important than a living worshipper.

  The actual "respect for Jehovah" blood issue was contained in the prohibition on "Keep yourselves free from things strangled..." because the blood was not poured out.

  Ask yourself a simple question.

  Why would Christians not be warned about murder if it weren't contained in "abstain from blood" (corresponding to the Noahide Laws)?

  The Watchtower Blood issue is a huge neon sign blinking on and off over a pawn shop where people offer their lives and the lives of their love ones for a cheap pawn ticket that buys them a martyrs death for no other reason than that they've been lied too about what is really valuable. Life is the greatest value; not approval from a book publishing company in Brooklyn!
• 

  superhooper

  i assume you dont work in the medical profession? if you do your very old fashioned. sorry to be blunt. but im english, your argument is flawed i am afraid, you may be blinded as anger towards witnesess is ever increasing for whatever reason. but this is an old subject that will only go away when the MEDICAL PROFESSION and GOVERNMENT educate and promote the correct facts. i am not a witness, i WAS a bible study and my father is very respected elder. i see both sides but im afraid yours is very odd and un factual. if that is a word! you see blood very rarly saves lives, it increases disease through the globalization subject eg. virus in remote village in africa reaches londons black communities. it has happened. HIV the early stages can be missed in blood screening.

  Jehovah makes it clear in leviticus and in acts 15; 28-29 how black and white. do you want it, if it was any clearer it would anger you that he thinks your dumb and it needs to be written word for word. like a childrens book.israelites were thousends of years ahead in their hygiene conditions because god knew that, if people had to drop a dump in the middle of the camp near food things like e coli would kill an unvaccinated population, cholora to! just to name a few of the possibilities. god had standards of cleaness... and washing your hands! how clever! except it isnt its just blatenly sensible!!!

  blood carries thousends of diseases, and impurities. its a human fluid and its droplet and what do most severe viruses and diseases come in? DROPLET! and what the quickest way to infect? IV! so you see god was making it very clear that it was unclean. let alone that it represents life. because you just cant live without it can you? the answer is NO! two very good reasons why you should listen to god. youl piss him off and youl get ill most likely.

  the fact is that most people dont want blood any more. because its dirty and trauma patients can have other blood less curing techniques even though they push it because frankly...its cheaper- a whole other subject. my sister could have had it but my parents stayed loyal to their god and her volume was increased another way. it saved her from blood loss.she only died because of other in curable problems.

  so please do not critisize mr rutherford, or their god. they follow the bible the way it should be, they are respected in the medical world alot and have helped in pushing reasearch to a greater depth which has saved people from taking blood and therefor has saved lifes where they could have been lost.

  one other point is it is a FUNDIMENTAL rule of a proper christian eg JWS not to have blood.

  would you make a jew it pork?no

  would you make a hindu eat a beef? no

  i rest my case...never ever has anyone got the right to say jws like killing children.

  people have left this subject in the last decade. i think you should too, most professionals in the medical field are being trained (like me a student nurse) to give medication with out blood transfusions.

  i apologise if i seem rude and my spelling mistakes.

  super hooper
• 

  sammielee24

  Superhooper....could you provide up statistics to prove your argument? Could you provide stats on how many people are saved by taking blood and for what circumstances? Could you give the same on how many died after taking it, the length of time that death took place and the odds for or against their recovering with or without? I believe it should be a matter of choice and not an order to abstain by a cult who martyr those who sacrifice themselves or their families on behalf of the leader(s) of that cult by refusing blood. swife.
• 

  superhooper

  i could but perhaps if look for your self in a un biased journal on that subject.

  you may see that other than the trauma patients long term and short term health is better.

  see it from a medical journal. your hate may run through your veins for this subject but its quite simple, iv seen better improvment in patients who dont take blood after surgery than those that do.

  im by no means completly clued up as i am still training and there are some very clever people on here, but taking blood is an old issue. i dont like smokers, well there habit but im not going to attack them and say they are killing there children through passive smoke. although by the sounds of it you might! :-)

  im tired of repeating myself i just feel that some of your arguments are attacking witnesess rather than the subject.

  if a person dies for there faith, it can make them the happiest person in the world and make them feel at ease.

  look it up. its black and white. or red should i say...ha ha british humour.
• 

  james_woods

  SuperHoopper, welcome.

  For sure I would like to know (and i'll just wager a lot of others here) - if you are not a witness, then what is it that you are looking for on this site? Somehow I don't read you as the conventional "witness apologist" that we get here from time to time. I (for one) have a few questions, if you would like to take the time to post something back...

  * As you state you are a non-witness, but that your father is an elder, are you saying that you are not in total agreement with the teachings of the Witnesses? In enough disagreement to reject the notion that you would follow your father's interests and just get baptized? I would like to know why this is the case. In other words, I hope you feel free to tell us a little more about your story than just the blood transfusion thing.

  * Are you aware of the long history of Jehovah's Witnesses with really strange forms of medical quackery? I mean, the teaching that vaccinations are wrong, that Rabies is non-existant, that certain electrical radio devices can diagnose disease, the heart is a thinking organ, aluminum pans, etc.. in past years in the WT and Awake...most all have either been forgotten or revoked.

  * Also, what position do you take on the recent news that the WTSociety says that almost all forms of blood fractions are permissible? If it were as a religious sacrement, shouldn't they all get poured out onto the ground?

  Thanks, James
• 

  inbyathread

  Superhooper - Welcome to the forum. Since blood fractions are acceptable I do have a question for you. Can a Hindu wear leather? How about a belt? Can a Jew use a Boar Bristle brush? Some cooking basting brushes are made with boar hair. These items could be considered fractions of the original animal. If you use Society guidelines, they can be used according to ones conscience.
• 

  schne_belly

  
  

  if a person dies for there faith, it can make them the happiest person in the world and make them feel at ease.

  How many happy dead people do you know superhooper????

  Welcome to the board!!
• 

  superhooper

  james

  sure, been a study since a little one step dad married my mum. i can assure u im not a jw. although im very fond of some of them. although some are strange! i stopped going bout 3 years ago, i got a gf and didnt want to be a hypicrite and lie to rents all the time. im not bothered by some of the hate for the witnesess theres alot of silly things that have happened and obviously annoyed people. the blood issue annoys me because i see more positives to not taking blood and the teaching is sound advice. and people call them child killers, im only defending there choice and that even though if my little girl needed blood desperatly me and my gf (no witness conections) have agreed we would push other methods if it came to it. and thats nothing to do with my influence. i perhaps can see why you may be baffelled by my presence. im just interested in what you guys have to day about a people who as a majority ( and there sins and annoying habits that we all have) are peace loving and dont want no trouble. seeing both sides on some subjects. but like i said some subjects are close to my heart.

  i really dont mean to affend and annoy by my blunt englishness and bad spelling.

  the faction thing, as i see it (and have read) is a choice for every individual, but i do see the fact is clear, its still blood BUT thats my choice and every witness can choose.

  any more questions for moi??
• 

  Thegoodgirl

  Super Hooper,

  Hey, welcome to the forum. sorry about the death in your family, and the stressful time that must have been. Maybe your sister did not die from refusing blood, but many others HAVE died from refusing blood. I am a nurse, and the need for blood is not "black and white". If a person's hemoglobin is 8.5, maybe they need blood, maybe not. It may be ordered, but if they refuse, they may still live, provided they don't have an active bleed. If the hemoglobin is 4.0 or 5.0, as happens with a very active bleed, such as in trauma situations, they WILL die without blood transfusions, and they will die very quickly. No amount of saline or "volume expanders" will save that life. Also, other organs will suffer in the meantime due to lack of oxygen. The patient can have a heart attack from the stress, among other things. I have watched that happen before my eyes.

  People on chemotherapy are often in need of blood transfusions, and they must have them since their body is not able at that time to replace the needed blood soon enough. Of course, it depends on how harsh the chemotherapy was on their body in their particular case, but you just cannot make the statement that there is always an alternative for blood transfusions.

  The larger issue here is, of course, that should we have to blindly follow what the WAtchtower Society tells us to do, or are we allowed to use our own brains? Are we allowed to reason out if we should take a blood transfusion or not? Or do we have to make sure our conclusions is in agreement with the one the Watchtower Society already came up with?

  I'm so glad you've joined the forum, it's a great place to be able to think and reason out things uncensored!

  The Good Girl
• 

  superhooper

  How many happy dead people do you know superhooper????

  thats harsh i know plenty of people who are happy to put there faith first and deal with the consiquences(bad spelling sorry)

  witness vs nazi?

  they had to sign a piece of paper

  my g father died choosing his faith first and he knew it would happen but that made him happy.