Hiya! I'm LDS too.
A:Negroes were refused preisthood and marraige in the temples and especially to white people - this command given thru the "prophets"...but oh look some of this changed laterso God must have made a mistake mmm..?
The whole world was denied the Priesthood including the tribes of Israel while a privileged group called the Levites held it for a long time, when Jesus came the gospel wasn't preached to anyone not a Jew until God then revealed that it was time to take the Gospel to the gentiles and the Priesthood was given to Greeks and others for the first time (and they decided post-Christ to do away with circumcision.) In all cases where a blessing is denied someone it is for one of two reasons. 1/ They (either collectively, their ancestors or they as an individual) have done something to reject it at some point. 2/The current holders of the responsibility aren't fulfilling that responsibility. In the case of the Priesthood I suspect that a combination of both were part of this and that the tragedy is it took us so long to be ready for God to finally be able to say - now share it with them - a change in practice just as great as taking the gospel to the gentiles. If you had been back in the time of Jesus you'd have posted a similar question about the preaching work then and possibly mentioned the convenience of God changing His mind. Does God change His mind? Ninevah?
B:After living on dog bones and charity because my unbelieving father was unemployed for months with no government relief ,the Elders kept track od the 10% tythe and demanded it of my mother when father got back to work...is that cruel or what?
Your use of loaded language does not convey what should and probably did happen here. I have never once met any elder who 'demanded' tithing. Did your Mother apply for welfare? You talk as though the church ignored your need (the LDS church produces vast amounts of food aid across the world and to its members - I know I've been on the receiving end and in turn I've been involved in financial aid, work projects for the needy and in delivering groceries to those struggling to make ends meet.) Of course claiming to be God's true church makes it difficult when a teaching designed to promote reliance on heaven and open the doors to blessings goes against the thinking of mankind - but then most people think God 'made a mistake' when He said tithing was required otherwise they'd not have changed their doctrine.
(Old Testament | Malachi 3:8 - 10)
8 ΒΆ Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.
9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.
10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.
????? I know literally hundreds of missionaries and returned missionaries and of that total 5(??) turned out homosexual. Basic stats.
D: Years ago 60 minutes did a show on Mormon homosexual men and in the process of the church "helping" them to overcome this the "treatment" was to expose them to electric shock to their genitals when aroused watching porno movies! How Christian is that ?
Using 60 minutes as your source of info - how stupid is that? No seriously have you studied this topic at all? Did you find out whether this was current scientific thought at the time? Did these people want to lose their homosexual feelings and were willing to try this ? What was the church's role - did it sponsor the procedure or did it take an active part...I could go on but at least we didn't reduce them to piles of salt which technically is possibly a divine solution to persistent offendors. Revelation isn't received for everything and as you'll notice the bible is pretty sketchy on homosexuality and advice - the church leadership tried something and it clearly didn't work.
I could go on but I don't want to seem as though I'm attacking you as I'm not but sincerely would like to hear your view. None of this is hearsay and to me these organisations just show how controlling and demonic they are.
'Demonic' - are you a demon expert, have you seen one? I go to church on a Sunday, I sing beautiful uplifting hymns, I worship God, I take the sacrament to remember my Saviour and renew my commitment to Him, I teach lessons about becoming a more Christlike person, about love, kindness and charity, after all that I spend time on the rest of the day checking that people are being looked after and cared for and that any questions they have are being met. Believe me I've seen demons and they aren't in the Church of Jesus Christ.
Hi! Any other Latter Day Saints here?
by ElderBarry 35 Replies latest jw friends
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Qcmbr
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sunshineToo
Hi, Lisa!
I'm an ex-jw. Welcome to the board, and I'm happy to hear that you've found a religion that you are happy with. That is a blessing.
sunshineToo
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praiseband
Hey Q! Hope you've had a good weekend. How did your "tiny throwdown" with the elders go on Saturday? I sent you a pm, but you probably didn't recognize the name and respond. But, how convenient that a new thread should have started up that would be appropriate to ask the same question here. Your last reply to me (and I have really appreciated them) talked about God the Father and how you hope to attain the title of god yourself someday. I am wondering about your wife one day becoming a god. I am wondering about God the mother. I am assuming from previous info you have supplied that there is one. Do you pray to her also? If not, why? I am assuming there is one, because I understand that God the Father was once a regular human being with a regular physical body. Therefore, there has to be a female counterpart....correct? Can you tell me where they reside since they do have physical bodies. I'm sorry for the naivete of the questions, but since I'm trying to gain a basic understanding I have to start with elementary questions. Thanks! Praise
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JWdaughter
Raised a JW and am an ex LDS person. I would still be LDS for the social structure, but I couldn't buy the religious teaching and felt like a hypocrite(testimony Sunday's anyone?) All religion has nasty things that go on, historically and currently, but frankly, I liked BEING a LDS person more than the others. And LDS people NEVER shunned me when I left(they gave me a BABY SHOWER and offered other help at times after I left!!!)and I still am friendly with them when I see them(I live in another community now).
Personally never had tithing discussions with anyone in the church, but most of my time there was as a youth. I did know of 2 gay guys, but I know hundreds of straight RM's so I don't think it is a major trend. I have never met a nicer group of people and if they are all faking it, they do a remarkable job at it!! If I could get past my conscience (and didn't have to live with my hubby) I would probably be one now. Tithing and all.
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juni
The bottom line to choosing a religion is this: WHATEVER FLOATS YOUR BOAT AND DOESN'T HURT OTHERS BUT MAKES ALLOWANCE FOR KINDNESS AND LOVE TO BE SHOWN TO THOSE AROUND YOU WITHOUT PUSHING YOUR BELIEFS ONTO THEM OR MAKING THEM FEEL A LESSER HUMAN FOR NOT BELIEVING THE SAME AS YOU.
That's my opinion. Peace.
Juni
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Qcmbr
Hi Praise - I did reply honest! Have a look in your inbox. The idea that we can become like our Father (and Mother) in heaven if we so choose (and if we don't we can still have an incredible fulfilling existence that will make us happy) is a beautiful concept. It makes the scriptures take on a whole new aim - rather than just a guide to happy living it becomes a training guide for Eternity.
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ElderBarry
Hi Everyone! Thank you so much for posting back to me! Yes, Megadude I have read "Under the Banner Of Heaven." I've also read Gerald and Sandra Tanners anti-Mormon books. Before I became a Mormon I read everything against the Church I could get my hands on. During that time I was also very involved in the life of my Ward. I had already made up my mind that:
1. Jesus Christ said that His true followers would be known by their LOVE not by their "correct doctrine." ("Correct" by whose standards?) Other Christians focus on the most nitpicking nonsense imaginable. I have never experienced the Love of God with another people as I have the LDS Church, both directly and through other Latter Day Saints.
2. All religions are simply attempts to give a conceptual structure to the experience of the Numinous. Joseph Smith Jr. had a powerful experience of the Divine and attempted to convey that experience in mythological form: The Book Of Mormon. So, I am unconcerned with the historical factuality of it all. I'm concerned with the FRUIT IT BEARS. I see it bearing very wonderful fruit in my own life, in the lives of my beloved fellow Saints in my local Ward, and the Church worldwide. Being composed of humans the Church is imperfect and you will not see perfection. There is some negative fruit. Yet, it's very minor overall. Yes, the Church is a bit slow and backward as to women, but trust me given time that will change.
When I was a Jehovah's Witness, I NEVER felt that the Governing Body cared anything about me as a person, or even the local elders. I was simply a loudspeaker for their doctrines and a money machine. My fellow Witnesses were suspicious, paranoid, snoopy, and out to find some reason to make trouble for each other. Yuck. Plus I hated the world and life when I was a JW. I couldn't wait for the system of things to end, for the great trib and battle of armageddon. As a Mormon, I love life, and I know that my leaders care about me as a person! My Bishop and Stake President are wonderful men, Godly men, deeply spiritual men, who give so much of their time and effort that I feel humbled. My local Ward is composed mainly of people who also love life, love God, and most importantly of all, love each other. I have genuine friends now, people who are always there for me, and I for them. This is as close to Heaven as a person can get in this life!
I burst into tears when I was baptized! I was so overcome by the Spirit of God! I knew that I had found my spiritual Home. I trembled with elation and the power of the Holy Spirit when I first stepped into a Temple. I never knew how important it is to the human psyche to have sacred space! I do now! A Temple is a very sacred place, far more so than any other building. It's been consecrated, set aside as a something special for God's use. Only those worthy can enter, not just anyone. You have to become worthy and demonsrate that worthiness in your life, not just say, "I'm worthy! Let me in!" The ceremonies in the Temple are special secrets, or should be. It's sad that misguided former LDS Christians reveal so much. Anyway, a Temple is a breathtaking earthly embodiment of the Heavenly Reality and I can FEEL that, experience that, in a deeply moving concrete way. A way that brings light and life and joy into my mind and into my life!
So yes, Justin, I'm a new order Mormon, I think. If a new order Mormon recognizes that myth gives form to Mystery, and that what matters is Divine Love and Transcendence, then yes I am.
I'm not an ex-Mormon, I'm an ex-JW, so I'm not interested in message boards for those who've left the Church. For anyome who has been embittered by the JW experience (I certainly was) and thinks that the LDS Church must be the same, uh uh. They're different as night and day, almost. One is almost complete darkness, the JWs. The other is almost complete light, the LDS church. (No, I'm not starry eyed; it's hard to be starry eyed when you have a very liberal understanding of religiona dn spirituality) So Wozadummy, yes, the Church masde mistakes and is making mistakes right now as I type this. Religious institutions are very slow to change. They have to be. It takes time to sort out which changes are for the good and which aren't. How mnay of you would respect the LDS Church if it simply changed with the times. like pop culture? You wouldnt respect it at all. So, the Church takes it slow. The leaders have an experience of the love of God just as I do, and they try to respond in a loving way. Thye want to guide the Church into safe waters. I appreciate this, and I am educated enough to know why it has to be slow. Wozadummy, yes, there are strange things in the LDS Church. One can focus on those things, and become very strange, angry, and bitter, or one can see them for the abberations that they are and put them into perspective.
I am a very social person and not interested in a solitary path, or to join some strange little sect that meets in living rooms and peers out at the world in fear and hate. Being a positive person I prefer to see the glass as half full. Trust me, its a much better way to go through life. I could stay very bitter because of my JW experience, but I choose not to.
Qcmbr, I will answer your PM very soon! Thank you for writing me!
Juni, yes, "whatever floars your boat" as you say. I like that.
JW Daughter, all religious teachings are kooky if looked at in the cold light of reason. I have a glowing, powerful Testimony based on my experience of God's Love in the LDS Church, the sense of Transcendence, not because the doctrine makes sense the way Aristotlean logic makes sense. Perhaps you could return with a new understanding? A new standard of judgement? I hope so. It really is the only Church for me. I love your comment: " have never met a nicer group of people and if they are all faking it, they do a remarkable job at it!! If I could get past my conscience (and didn't have to live with my hubby) I would probably be one now. Tithing and all." God loves you so very much, and God has people all over the world who love God right back! They show this love for each other and hang tight as a Body. Come back to us and just rest in God. Just rest in that Love. God doesn't care about the doctrines, God cares about the Love. You know that you experienced the Love of God in the LDS Church. I know it too. None of us are perfect, though you will find a few that think so.
God's blessings to you all. Thank you for the wonderful welcome!
Lisa -
DannyHaszard
4 years ago i did a comparison of LDS vs JW disgruntled member websites and i found 4 TIMES more per capita EX JW pages than Mormon pages
I do know that LDS helps their members prosper financially have schools charities and i may be wrong but they don't break up families with shunning like JW's.
I hear you really have to piss off the church to get ex-communicated?
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Double Edge
Well said ElderBarry. I have many Mormon friends. I've been on this board for over four years and I can't count the number of times I have to laugh at some of the misconceptions people have about the Mormons. As a social group, they are outstanding.... I enjoy most of the activities within their church, especially the sports and beach parties. I also enjoy getting into deep religious discussions without them getting "nuts" like my JW friend.... they feel no threat...just "take it or leave it...whatever" attitude. Your post is "right on" with my experience with them. WELCOME to the board. -
looking_glass
There are good people and bad people in all faiths.
However, as for the church catching up w/ the times and being respectful towards women, let me know when it catches up, till then I will worship in my own temple, one that does not discriminate against me because I don't have an extra appendage. Until then, ANY religion that treats women like second class citizens, is of no interest to me.