So Confused (page 2)

AuldSoul

RPT,

I recommend you use this: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/117482/1.ashx

You can almost use this as a verbatim script, try to get her to prove their doctrine on baptism to you. It is one I never encountered questions about while in door-to-door work, and I seriously doubt she will be prepared with any answer at all for this issue. She will have to research it to answer you, be prepared to let her. She will find there aren't any Scriptures to support these steps.

If she researches it out, when she realizes that she can't show you (and she can't show you from the Bible what isn't in the Bible) be kind and empathetic with her. It will be a shock to her system that she couldn't find the answer to such a simple thing; she may experience a range of emotional reactions, don't try to fix it, just soften the blow. Be patient, the turmoil will pass. But the fact that even the simple things aren't based on Scriptures is a big-time plus in favor of you winning her away from the organization; keep it as simple as possible.

If you need help as you go, just ask.

But, if she doesn't leave eventually don't keep indefinitely banging your head against a 10-foot-thick cement wall. If she is a true believer she may shut her eyes tightly against any other possibility, in which case she will probably not let you know that she couldn't find the Scriptures.

Respectfully,
AuldSoul

jgnat

You are helping her live a double life. The religion is a sickness she is too afraid to give up. What is very sick is that even though she is desperately unhappy, she wants to introduce you to the same sick religion! No! That's like a drug addict introducing their partner to heroin, so they can share the addiction. She is using you as a crutch and an excuse to pretend she has a normal life. As long as you are an "enabler" of her illness, you are part of the problem.

If you really want to help her, leave her. Or give her an ultimatum. She has to choose which life is more important to her. If she chooses the barren marriage, so be it. That's healthier than being stuck in the middle.

For you, Al-Anon meetings and learn all about enabling.

LittleToe

She's married AND in a cult AND is leading an extreme double-life - how bad does it have to get before you realise that you are the one that's going to get hurt in all this.

Even if you succeed in extracting her, the chances are that you will become the focus of her ire, when she loses her family and friends. I'd give you a 0.001% chance of ending up with a happy relationship with this woman. I'm being conservative with that figure.

Of course it's entirely your choice, your life, your heart, your decision. We've seen similar things around here far too many times. Sorry to be the bearer of such ill tidings

RPT

I think your right I think Im adding to the problem rather than helping. I know she is not a proper JW but she is just too scared to leave

undercover

Leaving aside the JW aspect of it for a moment...

You're messing around with a married woman. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Even if she says she doesn't love him, she's still married to him. And until she take measures to leave him or divorce him, how can you believe that she tells you that she doesn't love him?

Going back to the JW issue:

This only makes matters worse. She probably feels enormous guilt for living a double life. On one hand, she's pretending to ge a good JW but when she's around you, she becomes "worldly" (what JWs call non-JWs). She may not want to be a JW, but because outside of you her whole life is wrapped around everything JW, she doesn't know how to leave.

Even if she left the JW life and joined you, her entire JW family, parents, siblings, ex-husband and JW friends are going to blame you for causing this whoe thing. Are you ready to take on all that heat? You will never be accepted by anyone in that family/friend circle. Can you handle that?

And for her wanting you to read JW literature tells me that she's not willing to leave it just yet. If she can convert you, leave him, she thinks she's getting her cake and eating it too.

Bad deal all the way around.

My blunt advise is this: stay away from her...period. Let her make her mind up, on her own, what she wants. If, in time, she leaves the JWs and her husband and makes a new life and you can be part of it without ramifications of the previous life, then you might could pursue it. But until then, and it won't be anytime soon, your best bet is to stay away from that whole situation.

drew sagan

Welcome to the board!
Your situation is not a very good one, but there is hope. Since here husband is a true JW believer he is going to take the position that they should just wait for Gods new order and then everything will be fixed, so what if it means a lifetime of suffering and confusion 'at least we kept the status quo'.
I'm not for breaking up marriages, so i'm not going to give my opinion on that part of it, but I will tell you this. The girl needs emotional and spiritual support. She still calls it 'the truth'? If you are interested in helping her, the first goal should be to help her see it is not the truth.
There are plenty of great books out there that will help you understand all about JWs and give you good ideas on how to combat this. This forum will also help you as well. But dont forget these major points
- Her religious beliefs need REPLACED with something better
- Her mind is being controlled by her religion
- Her family members are being held hostage over her
- There is emotional stress concerning her marriage
All of these factors are things that are keeping her from leaving. First help her see it is not 'the truth', everything else will come afterwards in my opinion. There also though is the danger like little toe mentioned above that if she does leave she will be dependent on you. Her family will leave her and you will have to bear all of her stress and anxiety. She needs help, but if you plan on giving it to her you very well can become eaisly overwhelmed.

AuldSoul

LT,

There have also been successes, yes?

The points you outlined are true, but those same facts can be seen from another perspective more favorable to a good outcome: (1) They sleep in different rooms, (2) she is already violating some of the most inviolable doctrines of the cult, (3) her double-life (like any double-life) is a burden she bears; since the double-life is extreme, it is an extreme burden.

LT: Even if you succeed in extracting her, the chances are that you will become the focus of her ire, when she loses her family and friends.

If he loves her, his interest is in what is best for her, not in what he will get out of it. If it costs him a dear friend to give her a life it may be well worth the trade. And really, his next most rational option is to cost himself a dear friend by "running away" from her, so if that cost is there either way why not try to give her a life?

I know I would sacrifice my marriage in a New York minute if I knew that by doing so could free her from the tyranny of the cult mentality and free her to enjoy life. I love my wife deeply, but that trade would be worth it. For her.

Maybe that is where RPT is coming from, here.

Respectfully,
AuldSoul

Fe2O3Girl

Twelve years ago I was that confused, unhappy JW woman.

I did finally leave my husband and the JWs. However, I was a very mixed up, immature and needy person. My relationship with the new man, my knight in shining armour, who rescued me from a miserable life, barely lasted a year. I thought I was on cloud nine, but I was just way too clingy and needy.

JWs who are miserable don't stay because they can't prove it isn't "the truth". When you have never been part of mainstream society, all your family and all your friends are JWs, and you are going to lose all of them if you leave, you have to be very desperate to take that leap into the unknown. I never blamed the person I left for, but I expected him to fill the gap. No one person can do that.

RPT, she may leave her husband to be with you, but if she does, your problems are not over! JWs have some weird ideas about what normal (or "worldly" to use their jargon) people are like.

Good luck.

Rachel

Dansk

She's married AND in a cult AND is leading an extreme double-life - how bad does it have to get before you realise that you are the one that's going to get hurt in all this.

My thoughts entirely!

AuldSoul,

Glad you're still around

We only have HER word that she isn't sleeping with her husband. If the story is true and the woman's husband accepts the situation that his wife is seeing another man and they sleep in separate rooms I have to ask: is the husband gay?

So many gay JWs have got married to hide their gayness.

OK, if we accept he isn't gay, how many full-blooded men would allow such a situation to develop? How many men, including/especially JWs, would allow their wives to see another guy - whom she could be sleeping with - and also not sleep in the same room?

Which brings me back to LT's comment, which is right on the spot!

Ian

RPT

He could be gay for all I know. I keep asking myself as a man how can he put up with it. I trust what she says and I do believe they dont sleep together.

Time will tell I suppose. I just wish I was more knowledgeable. She is my best friend above all else.

So Confused

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