Best Disfellowshipping Comeback?

by slimboyfat 29 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Stealth453

  I might be wrong . . . but look up Percy Chapman.

  Sorry to temporarily hijack the thread, but this name rings a BIG bell with me, and I can't remember why. If anyone can enlighten me, please pm the info to me.

  Thanks...Stealth
• 

  blondie

  It is not too likely that anyone who once was an elder or CO or higher who was DF'd will be reappointed unless a great deal of time has gone by. They have to work themselves back up to MS then elder then...again. I have never heard of it. I did see several brothers have to wait more than 20 years to be reappointed.

  The most amazing thing I ever saw was a pedophile JW reinstated after 8 months..........and an adulterous sister not even considered for reinstatement until 8 years went by.

  Blondie
• 

  slimboyfat

  Stealth,

  Chapman was a homosexual at Bethel in Knorr era, from what I gather. There is a freeminds page about him, Chitty and Greenlees. I don't think he was re-appointed after being exposed, so I don't think he qualifies as a 'disfellowshipping comeback'.

  Slim
• 

  slimboyfat

  Blondie,

  I am not only talking about people being disfellowshipped while in a high position making it back again. I had in mind more ordinary Witnesses who are disfellowshipped, about their prospects for future appointments.

  Say someone is disfellowshipped in their teens and is reinstated pretty quick - could they hope to go to Bethel later, or become a CO? I have not seen that happen, so that is why I wonder about it.

  I do know one CO in England who had a bit of a reputation in his younger days for 'sailing close to the wind' as far as his conduct with members of the opposite sex was concerned. I always took this to mean that he got away with quite a bit of naughtiness because he is a rather large personality and well-respected - he probably managed to avert disfellowshipping somehow. If he had actually been disfellowshipped during his younger years, it seems unlikely that he would have used as a Training School conductor and now as Circuit Overseer, even if he was reinstated and fully repentant.

  There seems to be a stigma around people who were disfellowshipped that they can never get away from.

  Slim
• 

  Stealth453

  Hey Slim,

  Thanks. I will look it up. Do you know if he was assigned at the Canadian branch at anytime, in or around late 60's to early 70's?

  I appreciate your reply.

  Stealth
• 

  Stealth453

  Now I remember....I was supposed to room with this bastard, but refused. Guess my gut feelings were right.

  Thanks Slim.
• 

  slimboyfat

  Yes he was in Canada.

  You may also find the following interesting:

  http://www.freeminds.org/bethel/dave.htm

  If you can't be bothered reading it all, search for the bit about Greenlees.

  Slim
• 

  Fe2O3Girl

  Ah yes, the parable of the prodigal son.

  When he saw his son coming, he said "Give it ten years, then we'll think about having a barbecue."
• 

  tijkmo

  on the application for bethel , reg pioneer, and gilead, it asks if you have been reproved or df-ed in the past 5 years...in theory that means that after 5 years you do not even have to mention it..you just answer no.

  in reality however the applications have to be approved by the service commitee and the question is asked of them as to whether the applicant is now in good standing. so if they wanted to make a big deal of it then they could especially if they had been on the original jc and still held grudges.

  i have often wondered about the question have you been df-ed in the past 5 years...in my case i would be able to answer no after 5 years from the df date although 18 months of that was spent in a df state...in other words do you answer yes 5 years from the date of df-ing or from the date of reinstatement.

  interesting in the biblical cases mentioned of david, peter, and we could add moses, paul and barnabas (fighting is a df offence) and others is that jehovah recognized that these men were imperfect and therefore were bound to make mistakes..and even though they were punished and had to face the consequences of their actions they were not stripped of their dignity by having their positions removed from them and rendering them worthless. the wt org makes a big show of telling people how merciful they are and that jehovah will gladly use a repentant wrongdoer again in the future...but they then make them prove their humility by making them do an indefinate period of belittling tasks. i know of one case where a bro was reproved and removed as an elder and then given the job of welcoming people at the kingdom hall door. i am not saying that welcoming is a menial task. i am making the point that it is used as a test of humility..as a rule elders do not do the welcoming...or the hall maintenance (unless it is to get out of f.s.) ..this brother willingly and faithfully did this task for years whilst every time his name came up for discussion at elders meetings for further priveleges the presiding overseer would inform everyone that he would never approve him as an ms and elder..and everyone else was too scared of the p.o to challenge him..most genuinely sorry individuals feel so inadequate and worthless that they will gladly do anything that is asked of them because it gives them a sense of value..the fact that the org is so emasculating in their dealings with such ones shows who really are the bigger people here...and the fact that according to the bible jehovah never dealt that way with anyone is further evidence that he is not backing the wt.

  TRIED TO BE THE BIGGER MAN HERE

  BUT YOU MADE ME VERY SMALL INDEED

  VERY SMALL INDEED

  WANT TO FORGIVE YOU...NEEDING YOU TO ASK

  KNOWING THAT YOU NEVER WILL WHICH MAKES YOU EVEN SMALLER STILL

  mokosatsu...the irony
• 

  dozy

  I know a Bethelite who was df'd in the long past , but he has never got to Bethel elder status (now disbanded anyway) or was used as a Bethel rep for giving talks at assemblies. There is also an ex-df brother who serves on a RBC & HLC in the North of England. Both are quite open about their disfellowshippings and subsequent repentance , occasionally bringing it up in answers at the meetings. I don't know of any ex-df COs or DOs as there is a "glass ceiling" for such ones - I reckon that they would probably only appoint an ex-df individual in exceptional circumstances (eg if there was some question mark over the validity of the original disfellowshipping.)

  I would guess the issue isn't whether the person had been forgiven , but is more related to freeness of speech. Any CO , for example , who had many years ago been guilty of immorality or fraud , would struggle to give items from the platform or counsel elders on such subjects.

  It takes a long time to be reappointed as a MS and elder (though the 10 year rule isn't applied nowadays , directly , though it acts as a guide and is often brought up by old elders when such ones are discussed). The best tactic is to move away to a different circuit and wipe the slate clean , so as to speak.