Couple of questions...

by AnonyMouse 11 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  AnonyMouse

  Someone gave me an explanation, but I didn't really understand it. What is a dub? And what does it stand for?
  
  I can tell quite easily that some of you people were serving with the JWs for a long time, just by the way you type. You use similar sentance structure and wordings. That leads me to my next questions:
  
  Your status? I'm wondering if, did you get babtized and leave? Were you raised and left? And also, from some things I read, it appears that some of you are still active. I'm not sure why you'd be on this site...
  
  I know there's about a bajillion people that come here, because its been days and already my intro post is buried in the sands of time.
  
  Any other lingo I should be taught?
  
  
  I read something about "The 8 signs of Mind Control" once, and found it very interesting. I was tempted to use it to counter my mom, even going so far to replace 'mind control' (the average person probably things mind control is restricted to sci-fi) with something else. But then I realised that she would never understand it, then get mad at me for reading it, and just go into a homicidal rage from brain overload. There were some parts that took me several reads to get the general understanding of it. But there were a few parts in error. Most of it, such as "emotional, informational, and situational" made perfect sense.
  
  I'm just confused as to HOW this could have happened? Was there just a complete failure of thought? How can people fall into this? Don't they see the big picture? Can they not see they're being manipulated? And most of all, how can they be so fervent?
  
  I was under the impression from science books that the mother-child bond was very intense. But for my mom to do this to me...it's the first thing ever (aside from taking my favorite toy when I was 3) that has made me cry. I once prided myself over my control of emotions, even through the hormonal changes of my teenage years. But this...is the complete oposite of what I see as fair. To force your child through something like this, or face the consequences, seems to me like it breaks the law. I told my mom that, that the first ammendment should grant me freedom of religion. But she said no. I was surprised, and had to do research on it. From what I could gather from the Child Protective Services website, I actually have no choice but to listen to her.
  
  Unless I'm missing something here...I would have thought that I'd be granted BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS once I at least became completely sentient (I'm thinking I became truly sentient, aware of myself and suroundings completely, at around 13) rather than under 18.
  
  
  Sorry about that, I just go crazy it seems. One question sets me off, and I have to go into a long rant about things that are irrelevent to the topic. I'll just stop while I'm ahead.
• 

  Wordly Andre

  Anonymouse,

  A Dub is a Jdub, JW, Jemima witness, its just a little bit of slang

  I was born into a JW home, both parents were JW, I told them I didn't want anything to do with JW's when I was 15

  I was never baptized, I refused at an early age all the way till I left home.

  Most of the lingo I think is pretty easy to understand

  There must be a few JW logged on here at any given time, I welcome them as much as I do you, there is nothing that I fear from them.
• 

  TweetieBird

  A dub is short for JW. My parents were witnesses when I was born so I was raised in it. My dad discovered that it wasn't the truth when I was grown with children of my own. I was devastated to say the least. He would say things to me but I put up a wall, didn't want to listen to apostate lies. Over time, things he said made me think. After he died I started having doubts, specifically in 1996 when they changed the teaching on the generation, which he said would happen and that it would cause a domino effect. Anyway, I started doing research on the internet and slowly realized that the witnesses did not have the truth. My status is that I pretend to be a witness to this day so that I do not lose all of my JW family.
• 

  RichieRich

  AnonyMouse,

  I was an active witness all my life. Like you, I decided young that I knew the truth was a bunch of BS, but I got baptized anyway.

  I was active on this board for a year, and even after the elder's found out, they waited a couple of moths before they did anything.

  I was forced to Disassociate myself 5 days before I had planned to do it anyhow.

  Many active witnesses with questions come here- some know the real deal, but cant leave due to family.
• 

  Confession

  AM,

  JW family, four generations, 60+ years, over 30 still in. Former elder. Started to realize it wasn't "The Truth" while doing research for a judicial committee I was chairing. Years later (September 15, 2004) I knew for sure it had all been a big mistake. So far I'm the only one whose left. Last meeting May 2005. Moved 2300 miles away with 18-year-old daughter one year ago. Fading, fading fading...

  Confession
• 

  anewme

  Anonymouse, welcome!
  
  I was a JW for 35 years, elders wife for 20. When I got older and wanted to slow down a bit because I was tired and run down I got grief and trouble from all sides for it.
  
  This made me kind of mad.
• 

  rebel8

  I read something about "The 8 signs of Mind Control" once, and found it very interesting. I was tempted to use it to counter my mom, even going so far to replace 'mind control' (the average person probably things mind control is restricted to sci-fi) with something else. But then I realised that she would never understand it, then get mad at me for reading it, and just go into a homicidal rage from brain overload. There were some parts that took me several reads to get the general understanding of it. But there were a few parts in error. Most of it, such as "emotional, informational, and situational" made perfect sense.

  You can still mildly discuss these things with your mom by saying something like, "How could Jehovah possibly deem jws as being faithful when they are complying with the rules under threat of shunning? Threats are coercion." BUT I don't think you really want to go there. If I was you, I'd just lie low, don't oppose, until you're 18 and out of the house. Then you can explain your point of view. Doing it right now will probably just cause you lots of problems and not change your mom's mind.

  I'm just confused as to HOW this could have happened?

  It happened the same way all the other mind control groups formed over the millenia. Here's the recipe:

  Heaping cup of hopeless societal problems

  Quart of tendency to believe someone who speaks with conviction

  Pinch of hope

  Gallon of wishes to believe appealing ideas

  Half cup of predisposition to believe the Bible due to being raised in a predominantly JudeoChristian culture

  Gallon of wanting to feel special, "in the know", to stand out from the rest of humanity

  Half gallon avoidance of threatened consequences (shunning, Armageddon, etc.)

  Half gallon false promises

  Agitate in your blender until subject's personality is enmeshed with the rest of the congregation and he no longer is capable of experiencing his own emotional states or having his own opinion about...well, just about anything. Pour into a jar and seal--don't ever let him out. If he tries, mix in some more threatened consequences and/or promised deliverance and temper to a soft consistency.
• 

  fullofdoubtnow

  Hi AnonyMouse,

  I wasn't raised as a jw. I embraced the religion at 21, just after I finished University, was baptised at 23 and disassociated last year, so I'm now an ex jw and much happier than I ever was as an active one.

  Dub is just a slang name for jws, though my boyfriend, another ex jw, tells people who ask that it stands for distributors of unsubstantiated bullshit, which is true, of course.
• 

  Arthur

  I'm just confused as to HOW this could have happened? Was there just a complete failure of thought? How can people fall into this? Don't they see the big picture? Can they not see they're being manipulated? And most of all, how can they be so fervent?

  Mind control is complex. Unlike brainwashing, mind control is done with the full participation of the follower; however it can take on a form of brainwashing when used on children. For those of us who were born and raised as JWs, it is probably much more difficult to deal with the after-effects than those who converted later in life. From birth, we are heavily indoctrinated, and the JW world view becomes our entire reality. This coupled with the fact that there is enormous psychological reward and punishment used to mold and manipulate the minds of the average JW. The JW psychology with all of it's quirks and phobias becomes deeply ingrained. It is so deeply ingrained that it can take years for a former JW to purge themselves of all of the emotional baggage. This is not generally the case with those who converted to the JW religion as adults, and later on left.

  Sometimes it's difficult to explain to people who have never been in a high-control or mind control environment. The reaction of most (if not all) former JWs is to look back and ask: "How in the world could I have believed in all of that?" It is indeed very complex, so complex that sometimes we ourselves are at a loss for words.
• 

  Nathan Natas

  
  My mother began studying with the JWs when I was about 7 years old. I was baptized at 14 and left the JWs about ten years later. I pioneered back when it was a 100 hr/month gig, and I was a ministerial servant. I got a minister's classification from my local draft board during the VietNam war after I made 4 or 5 appeals and presentations to them. I've been out for more than a quarter century.

  I think that people get interested in the message of Jehovah's Witnesses - ETERNAL LIFE IN PARADISE - because of Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt (FUD). Back when my Mom responded to the JW who knocked on her door it was the mid 1950s. People had just come through WWII and the Korean War and they had firsthand experience with FUD. Nuclear annihilation was something everyone thought could happen any minute. Along comes the JWs. They tell people that there is a God in heaven who cares about them, and that soon - ANY DAY NOW - God is going to take a hand in the affairs of men and bring an end to injustice, evil and suffering. God's gift to everyone is eternal life in Paradise; all you have to do is follow a few simple rules, and God has lovingly provided the governing body to tell us what those rules are. Badda-boom, Badda BING! You're a DUB! You're gonna live forever! All you have to do to confirm your reserved seat in Jehovah's lifeboat-like™ organization is spend at least ten hours a month selling books and magazines from door to door. Your job title, though is not SALESMAN; it is MINISTER. If you follow the rules JUST RIGHT, you and your dependant children will be protected by Jehovah's magic protective bubble when the world is destroyed - did we mention that's going to be any minute now? - don't you want your babies to grow up in Paradise?

  I think that is how a lot of people get started. The WTB&TS depends on BAD NEWS to bring them people messed up on FUD. Once in, people typically do not leave until something happens to them personally that slaps them into a fully-awake state.