Help!! China and the Flood - insanity is nascent!!!!

by hamsterbait 19 Replies latest jw experiences

  • hamsterbait
    hamsterbait

    There was an Asleep! magazine in the 80's or early 90's about Chinese and how the pictographs illustrated things not mentioned in Chinese Mythology.

    1: The Chinese symbol for "covetousness" or "stealing" is a woman plucking fruit from a tree.

    2: The pictogram for "survive" is a picture of a boat with eight people in it.

    These exx. were claimed as remarkable since Chinese myths do not include the corresponding Biblical stories.

    Am I going mad?

    Is this a false memory - My Mom claims it is.

    I don't have the mags any more to check.

    Even more - I have found Chinese flood stories since, which makes me doubt the honesty of the writer.

    HB

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    *** it-1 p. 328 Flood of Noah’s Day ***

    It is of interest that the Chinese character for "ship" is derived from the idea of "eight persons in a vessel." This bears a striking resemblance to the Bible account about Noah and his family, eight persons, who survived the Flood in an ark (1Pe 3:20)

    ***

    g84 8/8 p. 21 Chinese Characters—Why Are They Written That Way? ***

    VESSEL

    + EIGHT + MOUTH = SHIP [Artwork—Chinese characters]

    The third part, "mouth," is a very common character that can also mean "people," much as it does in the English expression "another mouth to feed." So the character for "ship" is derived from the idea of "eight persons in a vessel." Curious, is it not? Where did such an idea come from?

    ***

    g84 8/8 p. 21 Chinese Characters—Why Are They Written That Way? ***

    TREE

    + TREE + WOMAN = GREED [Artwork—Chinese characters]

    The top part of the word, two trees side by side, is itself the character for "forest." Nevertheless, pictorially, the entire character seems to represent a woman in front of, or perhaps looking up to, two trees. Why would the idea of "greed" be represented this way? ...

    Well, you may recall the Bible’s description of the garden of Eden, in which two trees were mentioned specifically by name: "The tree of life in the middle of the garden and the tree of the knowledge of good and bad." (Genesis 2:9) Was it not Eve’s inordinate desire for the fruit of one of those trees that eventually led to mankind’s downfall?

  • badboy
    badboy

    YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS ,MAN!

  • Earnest
    Earnest

    In a book I have 'Fun with Chinese Characters 3' (1983, Federal Publications, Singapore) it gives the derivation of chinese characters for a boat or ship :

    As a memory aid, [chuan] could refer to a boat [first character] with eight [second character] survivors or mouths [third character] - an allusion to Noah's Ark.

    Earnest

  • funkyderek
  • jwfacts
    jwfacts

    I can not believe how much rubbish in the Watchtower that I trusted, it seems they basically picked up anything that supported the cause without background checking.

    Thanks for the reference site Derek, here is what it says about the idea of the word flood being related to Genesis.

    "The first character on the Flood page is chuan2, with the modern meaning "boat". The authors explain it as a compound made up of "vessel", "eight", and "person". However, the right-hand side of the character is simply the phonetic element. As mentioned on the Chinese Characters and Genesis page, the upper portion of the right-hand side does not mean "eight" in this context. It means "to divide". Here's Wieger on the phonetic element:


    Yan3. The ravines, on the mountains' ridges; separation (ba1) and flowing (kou3) of waters. Note the phonetic complex, chuan2, a boat.


    The remaining characters on the Flood page all lead up to the fourth character, yan2, with the modern meaning "drown". The authors interpret it as "cover over" and "water", but the "cover over" portion, also pronounced "yan2", is simply the phonetic element.

    In any case, it's hard to see how the idea that drowning involves being covered with water would in any way imply the Noachian flood. "

  • badboy
    badboy

    THERE ALSO A BIT ABOUT THE TOWER OF BABEL!

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    To quote from a book I have: it is [ AEONS, the search for the beginning of time ] by Martin Gorst...I highly recommend this book to anyone who is interested in "beginning of the world" chronology. It is the story of man's search for the origins of the earth and the universe.

    ____________

    In 1642 the Jesuit missionary Father Martino Martini arrived in China. For ten years he travelled the country, mapping its towns and villages, learning its language, and preaching the Catholic faith. (...) However, the more he learnt, the more he realised the scale of a problem that had dogged the Jesuit's attempts to teach Christianity since they had first arrived in the country seventy years earlier.

    The problem was one of chronology. When the first Jesuit missionaries had arrived in China, the Chinese had greeted their account of world history - drawn from the Hebrew Bible - with disbelief. The cause of this dissent was the story and date of the biblical Flood, the fearsome deluge in which, according to Genesis, all the people of the world had drowned except Noah and his family. According to the missionaries, this punishment from God had occurred in or around the year 2300 BC. The Chinese, however, dismissed this as impossible. Their own written history stretched back hundreds of years before this date, and made no mention of a worldwide flood. (...)

    Determined to correct this ignorance, Martini resolved to write a history of China himself. As he read through the (chinese) texts, however, Martini realised that the Chinese chronology posed a serious threat to the authority of the Bible. The dates of the Chinese Imperial dynasty indicated that the first emperor, Fu Hsi, had begun his rule in 2952 BC, some 600 years before the Hebrew date for the Flood.

    The Chinese records appeared more detailed and reliable than those of any other culture, including the Jews. They contained no bizarre myths or unbelievable legends, the lengths of the emperors' reigns were clearly documented, and even the earliest accounts had been <copied verbatem> by contemporary authors. With the intellectual honesty typical of his Jesuit training, he concluded these records to be genuine, and resolved to break the news to Europe.

    Like the response <..to an earlier reference published three years before...>, the reaction to the news that China's history pre-dated the Flood was overwhelmingly hostile. Most academics immediately assumed that the Chinese had exaggerated their history out of national pride.

    After the death of Martini himself, the contraversy he left behind continued to simmer for nearly a century. In response to the claims of the European scholars that the Chinese had fabricated their history, the Jesuits in China scanned the ancient texts for records of eclipses. By 1729 they had found 26 solar eclipses that "according to calculation fell on the exact year, month, and day indicated by the Chinese authors".

    For the Peking Jesuits, this proved that the Chinese chronology was correct, but it wasn't enough to convince their European colleagues. Nothing could even dent the Europeans widely held conviction that the world was less than 6000 years old.

    __________

    Amazing, is it not, how an established religion can take upon itself the illusion of having all complete and true knowledge, and in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, just continue off in a stubborn pursuit of their own beliefs. "Intellectual Honesty" seems to be a concept which they do not posses.

    I think we have at least one such "celebrated Watchtower Scholar" here on this site!

    James

  • badboy
    badboy

    WHAT EARLIER REFERENCE!

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    the "earlier reference" quoted was "Men Before Adam" by La Payrere, published about 1655.

    I skipped it over because of context.

    James

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