A co-worker of mine jokingly brought up a good point that I had never thought of before. She said that people are always concerned about whether Mary was truly a "virgin" when she married Joseph but what about Joseph was he a "virgin" as well? Is there a "double-standard" for men in the Bible? Did Jehovah allow men to have sex before marriage and condemn women the same pleasure?
Does the bible tell whether Joseph(Jesus' father) was a virgin before Mary?
by booker-t 12 Replies latest jw friends
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Gill
Because he couldn't 'prove it'!
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BizzyBee
Is there a "double-standard" for men in the Bible?
Do ya think?
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fullofdoubtnow
The bible doesn't say, as far as I recall, and I doubt Joseph wrote his memoirs, so it's a question that no one can possibly answer.
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lovelylil
Not in the book we call the bible. But there are other ancient books that claim Joseph had other children before he took up with Mary. Either Narkissos or Leolaia would be the best one to ask. I used to have a good software to look this information up on but my computer crashed and I cannot find the software again. But, I am sure either of them would know. Lilly
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BizzyBee
what about Joseph was he a "virgin" as well?
Joseph was quoted at the time as saying, "What happens in Nazareth, stays in Nazareth."
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Leolaia
Not in the book we call the bible. But there are other ancient books that claim Joseph had other children before he took up with Mary. Either Narkissos or Leolaia would be the best one to ask.
Yup, already covered that one: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/82425/1.ashx
Some relevant bits:
The narrative in Matthew 1:18-2:23 is indebted to extracanonical haggada on Exodus 1-2 which concerned the slaughter of the innocents by Pharaoh. In both cases, we have the birth of a savior-figure which was heralded by a divine omen, a tyrant committing mass infanticide to kill this threat to his power, a Mary-figure, the father of the savior-figure divorcing his wife, and the dream vision by the father concerning his son.... The father of Moses was Amram, and in Josephus (Antiquities, 2.210-16), Amram was fearful and unsure what to do about his wife's pregnancy, fearing Pharaoh's command, and God appeared to him in a dream and told him not to worry. Pseudo-Philo (first century AD) described this event but attributed the dream to Miriam. What is significant in this tradition is that Amram and the other Israelite men were supposed to separate themselves from their wives -- just as Joseph divorced Mary in Matthew... The closest resemblance, however, is with the Sefer ha-Zikronot, in which Amram himself acts on Miriam's dream vision and who had joined in with the widespread divorcing....Thus Matthew depends on the Moses-Amram-Miriam haggada of Exodus 1-2 to develop the story of the slaughter of the innocents, Joseph's dream vision about Mary, and his divorce of Mary, whereas Luke depends on the Samuel-Hannah traditions of 1 Samuel. There are more details in the Infancy Gospel of James that parallel both these traditions.
In the haggada tradition on Exodus 1-2, Mary (=Miriam) is the daughter of Amram, the father-figure (who fathers the Savior-figure, Moses). Mary is thus the sister, not the mother of Moses. In the Infancy Gospel of James, Joseph is an old man with grown children who adopts young Mary and takes care of her (9:11). When the time comes for the census, Joseph agonizes over his ambiguous relationship with the girl -- is she his daughter or his wife?
"And Joseph wondered, 'I'll enroll my sons, but what am I going to do with this girl? How will I enroll her? As my wife? I'm ashamed to do that. As my daughter? The people of Israel know she's not my daughter" (Infancy Gospel of James 17:2-3).
This tension between roles may thus arise in part from Matthew's casting a daughter-figure from the source traditions into the role of a wife.
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RubaDub
Joseph was quoted at the time as saying, "What happens in Nazareth, stays in Nazareth."
Bizzy ... LMAO
Rub a Dub
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Mary
Is there a "double-standard" for men in the Bible?
Gee, I dunno......that's a tough one:
Genesis 19:6-8: Finally Lot went out to them to the entrance and said: "Please, here I have two daughters who have never had intercourse with a man. Please, let me bring them out to YOU. Then do to them as is good in YOUR eyes. Only to these men do not do a thing, because that is why they have come under the shadow of my roof."
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Carmel
Kewl! The pleasure's the SAME!??
carm