Bizarre November 2006 KM

yakata

The insert is called "How Do I View Blood Fractions and Medical Procedures Involving My Own Blood?" I will attempt to transcribe the more salient points for everyone here.

Paragraph 1 (verbatim): The Bible commands Christians to "abstain ... from blood." (Acts 15:20) Thus, Jehovah's Witnesses do not accept transfusions of whole blood or the four primary components of blood-namely, red blood cells, white blood cells, platelets, and plasma. They also do not donate or store their own blood for transfusion.-Lev 17:13,14; Acts 15:28,29.

So, no apparent backing down from their position.

The next subheading is called "What are blood fractions, and why is their use a matter for each Christian to decide?" The third paragraph has the odd questions, "Am I aware that refusing all blood fractions means that I will not accept some medications, such as certain ones that fight viruses and diseases or that help blood to clot in order to stop bleeding? Could I explain to a physician why I reject or accept the use of certain blood fractions?" I don't know, can't anyone possibly explain the use or rejection of specific blood fractions? Does we just get a bad feeling around interferons? Who knows.

They continue to ask a few more questions under the subheading, "Why are some procedures involving the medical use of my own blood a personal decision?" To that end, they provide "WORK SHEET 1" and "WORK SHEET 2". On "WORK SHEET 1", across the left hand side it says, WHOLE BLOOD, PLASMA, RED CELLS, WHITE CELLS, PLATELETS, and above it, UNACCEPTABLE TO CHRISTIANS. Then along the right hand side it lists several fractions, with check boxes, "I accept" or "I refuse". The heading above is "Your personal decision" and then over the check boxes, "Choices you need to make". Few things feels as personal as filing out a form. ;^) The fractions are "ALBUMIN, IMMUNOGLOBULINS, CLOTTING FACTORS, HEMOGLOBINS, HEMIN, INTERFERONS"

On the second work sheet, it lists several procedures. These are, Cell Salvage, Hemodilution, Heart-Lung Machine, Dialysis, Epidural Blood Patch, Plasmapheresis, Labeling of tagging and Platelet Gel; Autologous. Here there are three boxes to check, I Accept, I might accept and I refuse.

so... What do you think of this exciting new message from the faithful slave?

imfreeimfree

Thanks for confirming that Yakata. Yesidid tipped us off about a week ago but without the details.

Thanks for supplying the "meat".

Looks like nothing's changed. Wonder what's the point?

BTW welcome to the board. You sure came in with a splash.

David

Arthur

so... What do you think of this exciting new message from the faithful slave?

The blood policy is getting more and more absurd by the day. How the hell does a JW make a decision based upon "a Bible-trained conscience", when they must try to intelligently understand a long list of very complicated terms, procedures, and technologies that are either "approved" or "not approved" by the "Slave Class". And furthermore, they must do very arduous research to figure out where the "Slave" stands on certain procedures. It's like trying to pick gnat crap out of pepper.

And when it comes to making decisions based upon conscience, what is a Witness to do? Go to Jehovah in prayer and go through this long laundry list of procedures and ask Jehovah to give them an itemized answer as to each and every technique and procedure? This is mind-numbing siliness!

As was brought up in a previous thread; why is a Witness even to accept any fractions from blood, if blood is sacred, and always to be "poored out"? If a Christian is to "abstain" from blood, how can the GB justify them accepting fractions from such?

The amount of hair-splitting that goes into the current blood policy is farcical. This definitely reminds me of the hair-splitting that the Pharisees used to do. It reminds me of the long list of do's and dont's that was drafted by the Pharisees as to activities on the Sabath. If only the GB was capable of some rational introspection, and see the folly of their own irrational reasoning. It's very sad when elders have to go "underground" and try to evoke changes in these policies without being "found out".

All of this might be funny, if it were not for the fact that people are dying because of the idiotic whims of a few megalomaniacs and a slimy legal department in Brooklyn.

zagor

I'm really sick and tired of this Watchtower bullshit (forgive my French). These sorts of things make people more confused than enlightened.
I was listening to one JW lady talking to my mom the other about her surgery not too long ago. She had triple bypass surgery and even refused to take machine that would recycle her own blood, and of course almost died, (mind you she's not out of woods yet) because of stupid Witchtower reference in one of older publications (I think United book) which talks about this procedure in light of old Jewish law where a blood of an animal had to be poured on the ground when it exited body.

When will they realize that their methods of applying old dietary law to everything is not much different to Pharisees' detailed guidlines of what is or is not allowed to do on Sabbath.

They talk about "Christian conscience" directing JW to refuse blood but then make ultimate effort to make sure that conscience of individual j-dubs conforms to changing stipulations from Crooklyn, or else.
In fact, all this sh*t is so confusing to dumb-down brains of awarage witnesses that many feel stumbled if someone's conscience allows them to accpet things like blood recycling machine or some blood derivatives otherwise allowed by watchtower.

fullofdoubtnow

The amount of hair-splitting that goes into the current blood policy is farcical. This definitely reminds me of the hair-splitting that the Pharisees used to do.

Good comment Arthur. The wts are the modern - day Pharisees, and even more hypocritical, as they criticise the way the Pharisees behaved, then behave that way themselves.

I can see this latest bs on the blood issue is going to confuse rather than enlighten most jws. It almost seems that the gb have confused themselves with this one.

greendawn

Difficult and complicated issues for those that got entangled in this cult their stand on blood is so legalistic and labyrinthine, why can't one have his own blood stored and used later anyway? My take is that they can't make any concessions that may open them legally to getting sued by the relatives of those who died after following their command not to receive blood. So the issue becomes very complicated.

Gilberto

Thanks and welcome to the board Yakata

This definitely reminds me of the hair-splitting that the Pharisees used to do. It reminds me of the long list of do's and dont's that was drafted by the Pharisees as to activities on the Sabath.

Amen to that.

why can't one have his own blood stored and used later anyway?

That part about it was my first thoughts when investigating the blood issue.

My take is that they can't make any concessions that may open them legally to getting sued by the relatives of those who died after following their command not to receive blood.

Agree with that Greendawn they simply cannot change their stance on this issue.

I also think complicating the issue makes it harder for the JWs to question it. One JW was said to a friend of mine when they questioned the fractions/components argument that it is complicated and a JW wouldn't understand it.

The whole blood stance stinks

moomanchu

JW,s are takers, I hate it.

I need blood fractions. I will not give any.

I need help from th red cross or other charities. I will not support them.

Why isn't the government doing more for me I pay taxes. I will not vote or get involved.

I will take your christmas gift. I will not give you any in return. ( I'll do it on another day, yeah right)

They're like vampires sucking the life out of people.

I feel better now

luna2

In fact, all this sh*t is so confusing to dumb-down brains of awarage witnesses

Its confusing to everybody regardless of intelligence, don't you think? Who can decipher the Watchtower's bizarre, convoluted reasoning? You'd practically need to go to med school to figure out wtf they are talking about....and to make some kind of informed decision.

Seems to me its a way of appearing to adhere to one of the defining tenants of Jehovah's Witnesses (NO BLOOD) while allowing an "out" for those dubs saavy enough to make use of it. It also allows them to point to all that "personal decision" crap when cornered by lawyers, doctors and governments.

Welcome, Yakata!

Oh, and Moo, I agree completely.

blondie

I think there are several factors in play here.

1) The average JW does not peer too deeply into the details of the blood issue hoping they never have to deal with it. Too many don't even fill out the forms the WTS provides (healthcare proxy: example in Iowa recently with husband and father in court over comatose wife).

2) The ones that do keep asking the elders, the Hospital Liaison Committee members, or calling headquarters to find out what they should choose; what won't get them DF'd (officially now it is a DAing offense).

3) Then JWs are suddenly in a crucial situation and no one knows what they really want, they don't know either. Many hospitals/clinics who advertise as 'no blood' require that legal documents be filed by the person some time prior so there is no evidence of outside pressure.

4) The WTS has tried to keep the information vague on purpose because they don't want to give the 'wrong' impression to the outside community that the WTS dictates to its members what medical treatment they can select, that it appears to be a conscience matter.

After a QFR in 2000, 2004 (identical) will this be the charm? Will the inquiries to the elders, HLC, headquarters taper off?

Blondie

Bizarre November 2006 KM

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