What basis for disfellowshipping/shunning?

by Bad Girl 12 Replies latest jw friends

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  Bad Girl

  Ok bear with me cos I am new to this and have lots of questions to ask.

  What scriptural basis is given for disfellowshipping and shunning ie what scriptures are used to say this should take place? I seem to recall a scripture (hoping someone can jog my memory which one it is?) about if a man wont accept counsel then to let him become as one of the men of the nations to you (or words to that effect?) and I have always thought that if that means you are to treat the man who wont listen to counsel as you would treat someone off the streets whom you dont know, then surely that means you should treat him with civility and respect even if he is not your "brother" ?

  If someone is disfellowshipped then why is it necessary for JWs to completely ignore them and not speak or acknowledge them?

  Jesus dined and spoke with many people including prostitutes, sinners, tax collectors etc and when people made mistakes he was patient and forgiving with them. Admittedly some people who are DFd are not repentant or sorry about their mistakes, but I somehow have a hard time imagining Jesus completely ignoring them and not treating them with civility and respect.

  Whats wrong with a simple "hello" or a smile or nod of acknowledgement to a DFd person? Why do JWs always take everything to extremes? What happens if you have an active JW and a DFd JW in the same house? You cant ignore them if you have to live with them can you?

  Lots of questions I know but these are things I have wanted to know for ages, but when you ask JWs you never seem to get an honest straight forward answer that doesnt involve the words "because this is what were told to do" or something similar I think you guys will give a much more honest answer as some of you may have experienced shunning first hand?
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  greendawn

  They are an extremist organisation they not only DF people for silly things like celebrating birthdays and Christian holidays eg Christmas but they also go to extremes in punishing those taht fall foul of their rules. The apostles did not have in mind, even for serious violations, the total shunning that the dubs practice but only a partial shunning eg not to eat together with the disobedient members since this meant great intimacy but it didn't mean total ostracism for those that wish to keep some contact. It was some sort of mild rebuke. I suppose the rest of the church were to keep on admonishing them to get back on the right way.
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  fullofdoubtnow

  Hi Bad Girl,

  The watchtower article of September 15th 1981, which you will find on this link, just scroll down till you come to it, will give you the information on why jws are expected to shun those who leave or are expelled:

  http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/disfellowshiping.html

  According to the jws, shunning someone is an act of love, to encourage them to mend their ways and return to the congregation, so they can enjoy the fellowship of other jws again. I used to believe that, now it seems a wierd way to show them you love them to me.
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  OnTheWayOut

  1st Corinthians 5:11 says

  But now I am writing YOU to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man.

  This is used as the basis for disfellowshipping. It, of course, doesn't say to avoid talking at all to him, but it has been blown way out of proportion by the WTS, and used for so-called sins not listed such as apostasy.
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  ButtLight

  I think if they would have changed that "rule" about shunning a long time ago, some of would still be in! My personal thought is if someone "falls short" that is the time they should get the most encouragement from everyone in the congregation! I was repentant! If I wasnt, I would never have gone in and confessed!

  Why not take those who have made mistakes, invite them into your home, and encourage them? Or make it a personal choice if they want to talk to them if they are "bad association"? Shunning is so cruel!

  I have had it done to me just recently in a resturaunt, where and elder and his wife moved from where they are sitting to get as far away from me as they could!! God was I mad!
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  zeroday

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  w748/1p.471MaintainingaBalancedViewpointTowardDisfellowshipedOnes***

  21

  As to disfellowshiped family members (not minor sons or daughters) living outside the home, each family must decide to what extent they will have association with such ones. This is not something that the congregational elders can decide for them. What the elders are concerned with is that "leaven" is not reintroduced into the congregation through spiritual fellowshiping with those who had to be removed as such "leaven." Thus, if a disfellowshiped parent goes to visit a son or daughter or to see grandchildren and is allowed to enter the Christian home, this is not the concern of the elders. Such a one has a natural right to visit his blood relatives and his offspring

  Apparently this "Balanced View" was not very balanced.
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  zeroday

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  w74 8/1p.467MaintainingaBalancedViewpointTowardDisfellowshipedOnes***

  5

  Congregational elders, as well as individual members of a congregation, therefore, ought to guard against developing an attitude approaching that which some Jewish rabbinical writers fomented toward Gentiles in viewing them as virtual enemies. It is right to hate the wrong committed by the disfellowshiped one, but it is not right to hate the person nor is it right to treat such ones in an inhumane way.

  They changed, it is right to treat such ones in an INHUMANE way.
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  ButtLight

  I really need to get me-self the watchtowers on cd!
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  Bad Girl

  Thanks for the info, I really think complete and total shunning is a very un Christian thing to do. I know I am not a JW but if I was, no way would I stop speaking to someone just because they had been DFd, thats doesnt make sense to me!
• 

  Forscher

  In 1981 the Watchtower published several articles which announced a hardening of attitude toward the disfellowshipped. One of those articles spoke of the attitude towards family members who are Df'd. It tried to parse things in a pharisaical manner, but the bottom line was explained thusly:
  
  *** w81 9/15 p. 28 If a Relative Is Disfellowshiped . . . *** 11 A disfellowshiped person has been spiritually cut off from the congregation; the former spiritual ties have been completely severed. This is true even with respect to his relatives, including those within his immediate family circle. Thus, family members—while acknowledging family ties—will no longer have any spiritual fellowship with him.—1 Sam. 28:6; Prov. 15:8, 9. 12 That will mean changes in the spiritual fellowship that may have existed in the home. For example, if the husband is disfellowshiped, his wife and children will not be comfortable with him conducting a family Bible study or leading in Bible reading and prayer. If he wants to say a prayer, such as at mealtime, he has a right to do so in his own home. But they can silently offer their own prayers to God. (Prov. 28:9; Ps. 119:145, 146)
  
  This is from the section on family members in the home. They had more to say on family members not int he home:
  
  *** w81 9/15 p. 29 If a Relative Is Disfellowshiped . . . *** 18 The second situation that we need to consider is that involving a disfellowshiped or disassociated relative who is not in the immediate family circle or living at one’s home. Such a person is still related by blood or marriage, and so there may be some limited need to care for necessary family matters. Nonetheless, it is not as if he were living in the same home where contact and conversation could not be avoided. We should keep clearly in mind the Bible’s inspired direction: “Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person . . . , not even eating with such a man.”—1 Cor. 5:11. 19 Consequently, Christians related to such a disfellowshiped person living outside the home should strive to avoid needless association, even keeping business dealings to a minimum...
  
  Why such a harsh attitude? The last paragraph continued with the following:
  
  "... The reasonableness of this course becomes apparent from reports of what has occurred where relatives have taken the mistaken view, ‘Though he is disfellowshiped, we are related and so can treat him the same as before.’"
  
  Although we know that part of the reason for hardening the attitude was to be able to Df Ray Franz for associating with his DA'd boss, the GB had noticed that the Witnesses were acting human with Df'd family members and wanted it to stop. That was the bottom line. The article stated its conclusion thusly:
  
  *** w81 9/15 p. 31 If a Relative Is Disfellowshiped . . . *** 28 Naturally, if a close relative is disfellowshiped, human emotions can pose a major test for us. Sentiment and family ties are particularly strong between parents and their children, and they are also powerful when a marriage mate is disfellowshiped. Still, we must recognize that, in the final analysis, we will not benefit anyone or please God if we allow emotion to lead us into ignoring His wise counsel and guidance. We need to display our complete confidence in the perfect righteousness of God’s ways, including his provision to disfellowship unrepentant wrongdoers.
  
  In other words, squash those natural emotions and be cruel because God's organization wants one to, or else.
  
  Forscher