Any more info on Nicholas Kip? (Witness apologist)

by slimboyfat 20 Replies latest jw friends

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  slimboyfat

  Remember he was the Witness who wrote a life story for the Awake! magazine where it explains that he taught Greek and he was impressed by the New World Translation and that is why he became a Witness. ("How Knowing Greek Led Me to Know God") Well, like lots of apostates I have always found his story interesting because of course there are many problems with the translation of the Greek that you might expect someone knowledgeable in the language to spot. Also while intelligent Witnesses can often learn Greek and go on to defend the NWT ably, it seems particularly peculiar for someone who already knows Greek well before converting to be impressed with Witness arguments on translation issues. What ever happened to him? Is he still a Witness?

  I am also particularly interested in his story because there is a bright Witness locally who frequently makes reference to this article and is clearly very impressed that someone knowledgeable in Greek came into the organization specifically because of the rendering of the NWT. So I always wanted to know what happened to him.

  Well I followed that link that was posted today to all those interesting testimonies from former Witnesses. One of the experiences was related by Jay Hess who famously wrote the booklet Jehovah's Witnesses Are Not False Prophets - only to change his mind and declare that they are false prophets shortly thereafter!

  http://www.jwinfoline.com/Page/audio.htm

  Well he mentions his contacts with other Witness apologists Flemings, Herle and Kip before he left the Witnesses. He also claims that Nicholas Kip left the Witnesses around the same time as himself; that was four years previous to the recording which was made in 1996. So that would mean Nicholas Kip left the Witnesses in 1992 only five years after he wrote the Awake! article in 1987. I would really like to share this information with the local Witness who is so impressed by this experience of the man who became a Witness because the of the NWT's scholarly handling of the Greek - but it would seriously blow my 'cover' I suspect.

  Anyway, I can find no other confirmation about Nicholas Kip leaving the Witnesses. Has anyone got any more information on this? Can anyone confirm that he left the Witnesses or even have contact information for him?

  Given the big thing the Awake! made of this man becoming a Witness while teaching Greek - and Witnesses still refer to it - I really think his story of departure from the Witnesses would be one worth telling.

  Maybe there is information already on this on the Internet, but I can't find it.

  Slim
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  slimboyfat

  Well here is his academic page, and an active contact email link:

  http://www.andover.edu/languages/greek.htm

  I have tried to contact him. It will be interesting to see if he responds.

  Slim
• 

  slimboyfat

  Here are quite recent comments on his teaching performance:

  http://www.ratemyteachers.com/schools/massachusetts/andover/phillips_academy/nicholas__kip

  I suppose this comment is midly interesting from the point of view of what his current general outlook is, interpreted extremely cautiously of course given the source:

  "Kip is awesome. What other teacher talks so much about sex, other than Ada? Kip is cool and totally understanding all the time. If you do your work, you're fine."

  Slim
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  Fatfreek

  His name appears quite unique so it's an easy one to Google on just that. Wrap it in double quotes, "Nicholas Kip", and voila! I got more than 400 hits. The top one is a link to a person who teaches, among other things, Greek. It may be the same one. Now teaches at Andover, if I remember correctly. With that info, you could reach him there and ask him.

  Fats
• 

  slimboyfat

  And here is a picture:

  http://www.andover.edu/publications/1999fall_bulletin/cominghometoteach/cominghometoteach8.htm

  From that article it seems that he encouraged both his children to pursue higher education, completing their courses in 1985 and 1991 - well before the organization relaxed its stance on this. I wonder how that sat with Witnesses in his local congregation - though the fact he wrote the article for the Awake! in 1987 shows he was still flavour of the month then at least.

  It also mentions he is with his second wife - though it does not mention whether she is the mother of the children mentioned or give any more details. (not that you would expect such details, in fact it is strange it mentions "second wife" at all) I wonder if that had anything to do with his exit.

  Slim
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  Leolaia

  Very interesting topic! I would be particularly interested to know if he still has the same opinions about the NWT and the meaning of stauros (his comment about which I found to be off the mark).
• 

  slimboyfat

  Additional information:

  Robert Bowman notes in his Jehovah's Witnesses, Jesus Christ and the Gospel of John that Nicholas Kip turned down a direct invitation to dialogue on John 8:58 in 1987, referring to such dialogue as "fighting over words". (page 13)

  Slim
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  Fatfreek

  The following is from Freeminds.org, a quote from Kip, "Since I did not learn Greek from a theologian who was teaching New Testament Greek, I was probably much more objective about it. I could look at the words with fresh eyes, free of the traditional, doctrinal notions. . . . . . . . . . . . . "...The quality of Greek scholarship in The Kingdom Interlinear Translation Of The Greek Scriptures , however, is very good....I feel it's one of the greatly under-appreciated jewels of the Watchtower Society's publications."

  I find it especially interesting that his compliment is not of the NWT but of the Interlinear Translation. While this is completely out of my turf, I've seen enough discussion here that those are often two completely different animals. There have been many JW's that have stumbled over the discrepencies between the two when it comes to various doctrinal matters.

  Fats
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  slimboyfat

  This is what Jay Hess says 31 minutes and 40 seconds into his talk about leaving the Witnesses:

  Had some friends. Made some friends. Encountered some friends along the way. Em. Drop some names. Remember Nick Kip who wrote the Awake! article "How Knowing Greek Led Me To The Truth"? Interesting he was leaving the Watchtower the same time I was. Em. He's been out for four years.

  According to the webpage Hess was speaking in 1996, so that would mean Nicholas Kip left around 1992:

  http://www.jwinfoline.com/Page/audio.htm

  Slim
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  misspeaches

  Slim I hope you find out what your after... This is definately an interesting topic. I'd be interested if you got a reply from him too.