God's People

by Frenchy 28 Replies latest jw friends

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  Pathofthorns

  Martini

  It is just how you think that keeps so many in the WT loop. The difference with you, is that you are endeavouring to be honest and take a look at the facts.

  What you will find is that everything that seemed to make so much sense, ie, Generation understanding, no blood, WT telling governments where to stick it and not giving a damn about legal consequences, are all abandoned. Now everything has become wishy washy, ambiguous, vague.

  The membership has no idea where they are going and what they believe. That the end is coming "soon" is wearing so thin. The people are tired and losing their minds.

  The God of the Bible's direction was clear and definite. There was no doubt in the minds of the followers. Today many Witnesses are actually concerned about whether our beliefs conflict with the Bible and whether remaining a Witness takes away our freedom to worship god with a clean conscience.

  Just take your time and think, reflect on things. There's no need to make any rash decisions. You will find remaining a Witness will simply allow you to continue to asking the same questions over and over, always hoping that things will get better, always hoping the end will save you. Perhaps it will, perhaps not. Just look at the 60, 70, 80 year old witnesses in your hall. That will be you.

  Path
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  Frenchy

  Martini:
  

  Frenchy I'm sure you know that I am not desiring to be apologetic for the WTS.

  Even if you were I would still respect your opinion. I posed that question because it appeared to me that you may still have some suspicions that the WTS is somehow connected with Jehovah’s purpose for mankind. I would genuinely be interested in knowing why you feel that way. The statement you made on your last post only strengthens my feeling on the matter:

  I have a feeling the WatchTower and Jehovah(the God of the bible) are very similar and connected in intent and purpose.

  I’m just interested in what makes you feel that way.
  …Whenever you have time.

  Tom:
  

  In my opinion, Frenchy was just trying to decipher your purpouse when he said what you quoted above.

  Correct. There is a difference between a sincere question and a leading question. My view on the matter is this: If you want to make a statement then do so. If you want to ask a question, that’s all right too. But I don’t like leading or loaded questions.

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
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  Martini

  Hi Friends,

  Path said:
  

  You will find remaining a Witness will simply allow you to continue to asking the same questions over and over, always hoping that things will get better, always hoping the end will save you. Perhaps it will, perhaps not. Just look at the 60, 70, 80 year old witnesses in your hall. That will be you.

  Not really! I have come out from under the 'WT Spell' but I still consider myself a witness of Jehovah. Although I am NOT following the WTS routine, I feel it's a previledge to have in the very least found the person of God. Not that we will ever fully understand God but at least I think that on account of what was presented to me through the JW's religion that I may be headed in the right direction towards understanding this life and the Creator that has given it to US. I say "may be headed", only because it remains a choice that I can make (as any individual can)to pursue.

  I believe it's important to separate God from the entity know as WTS.
  Unfortunately we cannot explore each and every religion, in which case I feel this one has an advantage. JW's the religion (in it's purest form)is worth examining, more so than any other Christian religion.T o me there is a difference, I plan to continue posting and enlarging on these personal thoughts on this board.

  Frenchy I'm glad you would like to exchange thoughts on these matters I only ask that you be patient as time is a precious commodity at this particular time, as it is I' sure for ALL of us including yourself. Basically I the reason I haven't given up on JW's is because I find there is a missing link to God when it comes to all the counter arguements presented by former witnesses (especially the intellectual types).Too often they are not comparing 'apples with apples'. I wish to explore religion in it's purest form, if there is such a thing. Not to do this is to concede to the belief that there is no God.

  I think it was premature for the bible students to have declared the "Finished Mystery" of God's restoration promises back when they did, because evidently the process is ongoing!

  Later,
  Martini

  Edited by - Martini on 22 November 2000 22:13:59
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  Pathofthorns

  Apologies Martini.

  I hope i didn't offend. I think i've misunderstood what you were saying.

  Path
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  Frenchy

  Martini:
  I understand about the time business. There are periods when I simply do not have any spare time at all. Whenever you do, just drop us a line.

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
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  Martini

  Hello Peeps,

  Path , No need for apologies, just your friendship. smile:)

  Frenchy:
  

  I posed that question because it appeared to me that you may still have some suspicions that the WTS is somehow connected with Jehovah’s purpose for mankind.

  Good choice of words Frenchy, 'I have some suspicions' is right!

  However I think I can validate these suspicions then again they may only be valid with my personal views! If we were to stop and evaluate all the particulars that are undisputed between 'opposers' and active witnesses regarding the JW faith, we come up with some excellent points of universal interest and benefit. Especially in ethics.

  Could it be disputed that this religion is world ronowned for the moral discipline that it's members reach out for?
  Like a madatory military service, it should be universal law that people everywhere should in the very least be raised JW's for their moral or I would expand to include 'the world view' of JW's.

  For me religion in it's purest form i.e. 'true religion' is all about 'ethics'. We would be hard pressed to find an international group that could compare to the ethical code 'desired' by JW. The key is 'ethics' so why the need to argue about everything else under the sun? I believe that in discussing acceptable religion that Jesus was never long and drawn out to explain it as so many intellectuals are.(See H2O) In fact he summed up the entire obligation in two simple commandments which embrace the foundation of true religion Mt22:40. Where JW and others go beyond this is their pitfall. Other aspects revolving around chronology,archeology,science,academics etc,etc are not the measuring tools for finding true religion, in my opinion.

  Jehovah God WILL have his "day" when humankind will be as religious as Christ was. In my view this is God's ultimate plan for mankind and JW's may have played a contributing role towards it.

  When and how all this will play out...well I don't know but I'm confident it will for God "causes to be" as his personal name implies.

  Later,
  Martini

  Edited by - Martini on 26 November 2000 13:53:25
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  Frenchy

  Martini:
  With the encroachment of age relentlessly pressing in upon me I find myself graying. (Not talking about the hair, now!) I find myself shying away from the black and white, viewing them now as the idealistic (and thus unreal) extremes of all the actual reality that lies in between. With that in mind I am wont to give careful consideration to your statement:
  

  If we were to stop and evaluate all the particulars that are undisputed between 'opposers' and active witnesses regarding the JW faith, we come up with some excellent points of universal interest and benefit. Especially in ethics.

  
  Interesting that you put into words what seems a great difficulty for the vast majority of all who are involved in the JW experience to even entertain openly in the privacy of their own minds. And so the great truth surfaces here that is so often forcibly submerged into the ocean of obscurity by the profusion of words to which there seems to be no end. Alas! I am as guilty as any and more so than most in this respect I fear. Undisputed particulars. Particulars which are agreed upon by both sides are to me far more interesting that the differences.
  You bring up the matter of ethics. Are JW’s more ethical than the world in general or is it that among them there is a greater concentration of ethical people? Who would care to comment?

  -Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-
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  waiting

  Hey Martini,

  For me religion in it's purest form i.e. 'true religion' is all about 'ethics'. We would be hard pressed to find an international group that could compare to the ethical code 'desired' by JW.

  'desired' is a whole different ballgame than 'accomplished.'

  Read any professional code of ethics - they are what those professionals desire to attain. Read any religion's books or encouragements - they are what they desire to become. Look at any politician's rhetoric - many desires, some accomplishments.

  International Group with ethics which could be compared with those of JW's? Greenpeace. Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals. Habitat for Humanity. Peace Corps. That group of doctors on that ship who visit countries and do free surgery on villagers. Red Cross. Missionaries from many different religions.

  Maybe not higher in the religious scheme - but as high/higher in their own way. Who says the JW way is the right way? Perhaps these people believe their work is showing their faith. Perhaps they're right.

  There was a long thread on H20 about this very subject about a month ago. Many people desire high ideals - many accomplish them. Atheists, Christians, Jews, Arabs, etc. High ideals don't necessarily have anything to do with religion. It has to do with humanity.

  waiting

  Edited by - waiting on 26 November 2000 17:24:45
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  Carmel

  man, 1176 posts...what a windbag!

  Geeze eyes, the weather sure has got you going!

  carmel going back out to enjoy the thunder and lightening