Is the UK failing it's children?

New Worldly Translation

There was an interesting program on BBC's newsnight about the recently released UNICEF report on child well-being. The UK came bottom of the list with Scandanavian countries and the Netherlands top. This report comes after another list placing the UK 37th in the best countries to live in the world, below such places as Latvia and Panama (no offence to those respective countries but we in the UK, maybe being delusional, expect to be higher)

UNICEF report - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6359363.stm

Is the UK going down the pan? Are there any political answers to this or is it down to personal responsibility?

One thing the government has done is devalue the working class. Apprenticeships and vocational qualifications for those without academic skills have been scrapped in favour of getting students into university to comply with arbitrary figures for the number of students in further education. This is despite many courses having very little educational and work related value.
We now have a position where we don't have enough skilled workers and have to employ people from eastern Europe and Poland. Businesses argue that UK workers don't want to do manual work but this isn't strictly true. Workers would do manual work if they were valued as a useful part of the workforce and not looked down on. If carpententry, plumbing, construction skills were given the same priorities as academic courses it would give kids taking up those skills a sense of self esteem about what they do. Even cleaners, factory staff and fruit pickers etc need a change of status. UK Workers are reticent to do these jobs not because they find the work in itself repulsive but because it very rarely pays a living wage and the amount of snobbery towards that type of work. One thing in the UNICEF report that struck was that countries like the Czech Rep. scored better not because it was more affluent but because there was more parity in their culture and a more equal distribution of income so people felt better about themselves. It seems lots of kids in the UK feel out of place in society and pessimistic about what their future holds due to their perceived worth in the community and the nullifying of their personal ambitions to comply with government guidelines.
That's only a small part of the equation and there are probably more important factors. What are your thoughts?

undercover

I'd say that kids in Iraq have it a little worse off than kids in the UK.

Not to make light of problems in the UK, or anywhere else ('cause the States have their issues as well), but when compared to third world countries and war-torn countries, I think we can appreciate that we and our kids have things pretty good.

Crumpet

First of all great idea for a thread NWT. Lots of points raised there. I would start with this firstly:

Workers would do manual work if they were valued as a useful part of the workforce and not looked down on.

is this true generally or just a small exception to the rule. As it seems all too many have no worries about what anyone else thinks if they decided to do nothing and live off the state and the tax payers.

Crumpet

Also I am not so sure that workers such as builders, electricians, plumbers are all that looked down - I know one or two men in high paying high demand managerial positions paying extrmely good salaries in the london area who are re-training to be a plumber and an electrician so that they can have more time with their families. They dont look down on these professions - but you're right that there must be a gap in the workforce for these positions or people wouldnt be swapping lucrative managerial positions for what they say could be an even better salary and certainly give you more time.

Sad emo

Too many rights, not enough responsibility.

I'll admit that I, like a lot of others used to blame what's happening on the Thatcher era, but with hindsight I think, yes she was promoting a kind of individualism but it was 'responsible' individualism - not individualism at everyone else's expense.

Now we're left with a society which is being eroded by 'rights' - nobody will take responsibility for their own actions, they either expectt someone else to supply their needs or blame someone/something else when things don't go how they want.

greendawn

Indeed self employed plumbers, builders and electricians and any occupation to do with house maintainace are making a fortune especially in places like London where maintainance work never ends with so many old houses there, they certainly make more than the average person with a degree.

lowden

I'd say that kids in Iraq have it a little worse off than kids in the UK.
Not to make light of problems in the UK, or anywhere else ('cause the States have their issues as well), but when compared to third world countries and war-torn countries, I think we can appreciate that we and our kids have things pretty good.

What kind of argument is that Undercover??

Oh well that's ok then! We won't be concerned about our kids because there's kids in 3rd World countries that are much worse off.

"Eat your food Jonny, there's kids starving in Africa".......

You dodge the issue,for some reason, with a point of view that has no relevance to the topic.

By the way, there are people in your country AND ours that are living in poverty and i'm not just talking about the homeless.

Yes NWT the UK is failing it's children (as are other countries). The UK has become a very sad place to live in many ways.

Lowden

Gill

Children's needs are far more complicated than their wants.

Someone needs to be there for them all of the time, at least up to age 16 and this is impossible if there is only one parent in the house who needs, naturally to work, and equally difficult if both parents have to work. The parent who is 'with' the children needs to be able to control, discipline, entertain and teach the children.....hard enough for an intelligent person, let alone the not so bright and those who tend to be selfish.

It is non stop work and effort even if the kids are well behaved by nature! Parenting is also looked down upon which means that parents not only do not value their role, but children also do not value the role their parents have to take.

The next generation is also undervalued as parents seek 'self growth, and self fulfillment' rather than 'growth' of their children and no longer put the next generation and its welfare above their own.

Have you ever tried to get one of your children on an apprenticeship in the UK? They barely exist anymore! We have sailed a generation of talent down the river and sold their hope to profit making industry. Even government will not invest what is really needed to develop the talents of our young people!

Parents, government, and society in general choose to fear a generation of feral children, left to fend for themselves, if not physically then emotionally and mentally. Everything with the older generation is 'Me, me, me!' No wonder the kids have little respect for their elders anymore.

The next generation must always be nurtured and loved, and above all put first in their NEEDS. Instead, the generation that should have been doing that chose to chase their own dreams and fantasys and pretend that they were still teenagers and forgot all about tomorrow! They chased drinking, eternal youth, self pre occupation, 'going out' constantly and forgot the kids at home. Ours is the generation that didn't want to grow up. I see it in neighbours who changed partners regularly, forgot about their kids while they went out courting, yet again, and came home to pregnant 13, 14 , 15 year olds who had been left to fend for themselves while Mum or Dad went out boozing and shagging left, right and centre. Parental selfishness damaged a high proportion of this countrys young and vulnerable.

Sow the wind and reap the whirlwind!

Fe2O3Girl

This study is on the wellbeing of children in wealthy nations - so of course children in impoverished countries are going to be worse off! But we have to ask ourselves - is this good enough? Why are some countries so much better for children than others? Why do twice as many infants die in their first year in the USA compared to Iceland? How do we measure national success?

The full report can be viewed here:

http://www.unicef-icdc.org/presscentre/presskit/reportcard7/rc7_eng.pdf

I think that most of the categories measured could be positively influenced by parents. Gill is right, parenting is grossly undervalued, but then again, we seem to do it so badly! It isn't viewed as a massive responsibility, the most important thing a person will ever do in their lives. How many parents to be have prepared, planned, searched their hearts and minds about what they are going into?

These kids are going to be the policemen, doctors, nurses, carers, scientists, teachers, politicians and plumbers when we are in our dotage - we will need them! Looking forward to it?

Crumpet

Parenting is also looked down upon which means that parents not only do not value their role, but children also do not value the role their parents have to take.

Gill - that is so very true. I know that I am not the only one who views parenting at times as a cop out life - mainly when it involves single women who then choose to let the state support them. Having said that I have nothing but admiration for single mothers who work their socks off to support their kids.

Is the UK failing it's children?

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