Today Is My Point of No Return - Or Is It?

by TheMan 23 Replies latest jw friends

  • TheMan
    TheMan

    OK. I posted about a month ago, about how after having many doubts, and just not wanting to spend more time doing the "Witness" thing anymore, I risked it all and spilled the beans to my wife. Luckily, (for the both of us), my risky venture paid off. She was in agreement, as she too was "tired of it." This has been great for us, and we are looking forward to being "free" of this weight on our shoulders.

    Apparently this has been coming for some time; it's just that one kept going because of the other! Also, my mother, and my wife's parents, are witnesses.

    Here's what we've been through in the past year. We changed congregations about a year ago. In my old hall, (which I grew up in), I had been serving as a MS, and at the point of changing halls, was essentially "burned out." I was giving talks all the time it seemed. (Us MS's had more School and and Service Meeting parts than the elders, it seemed!) I also had some of the weightier MS responsibilities, and had some unique family obligations, which I won't go into just yet. However, since I had grown up in the hall, my wife and I were able to "float along." We never consistently go tmore than 5-10 hours a month. In fact, I was appointed a MS only about two years after I was reinstated - (And not doing anything spectacular, I might add.) I basically knew the game, and played it. Being a JW was all we really knew! We also had many other younger couples our age in the hall, and we always stuck with each other when it came to service, hanging out, stuff like that. Although for some reason, we never got really close to any of them, which was always a source of frustration for us, especially my wife. Most were related to each other in some way, so they stuck with family. They weren't all that way, but most were. Anyway, many of us were floating along too, with the others that were simply serving because they were afraid of elder daddy and mommy. (So lame.)

    Anyway, my wife and I decided to change halls about a year ago, as we lived outside my old hall's territory so for convenience purposes, we switched to the hall that was about five minitues down the road, instead of 25 min. The change had quite an effect, as we abandoned a hall that had many other couples of the same age, for one that is much older in terms of average age. Not only that, but this new congregation is much more "spiritual." At first, it seemed great! The first meeting we attended there, every elder, and most members of the cong. greeted us, and we felt very welcome. (It helped that there were a couple of friends there that knew who I was, knew my parents from way back, and were aware of the fact that I was an MS, which they desperately needed (they only had one at the time!)).

    Again, at first, we thought it was great. What a change from our old hall!! Everyone seemed genuinely spiritual. We were invited to people's homes, and to eat out after meetings constantly. As a whole, the congregation was very spiritual compared to my old hall, and I still believe that is true. Except now, my wife and I are sick and annoyed of it.

    The annoyance began when it became very clear that people would not leave us alone. Things came to a head when an elderly family member of mine began to get very sick. This was both very stressful for both my wife and me, and so I missed a few meetings here and there; some evenings I needed to attend to things, and other nights I just needed to deal with the stress. But then, the phone calls started. Almost every night, I would get a phone call from my book study overseer, asking how I was, where I was. Sometimes, a phone call to confirm the announcements that were given on Thursday night, and other weird stuff like that?!? I'd also sometimes get calls on Saturday AM, asking where I was, and would I like to meet with the service group later that AM?? (Mind you my service time was not lacking at the time.) We then got a sheparding call, then when we missed one day of the two day convention, they "noticed" and stopped by that evening. At first it felt nice to feel the "concern", but after a while it seemed to go out of conrol. I felt like I always needed to give a status update to the "brothers" all the time. I understand some would love to go to a hall where attention of this kind is given, but my wife and I have always been very private people...And we were not keen to this at all.

    (This is unrelated, but one of the bros on the sheparding call said, "Why is it that members of Christendom, when they experience hard times, go to church? Whereas Witnesses, when they experience hard times, stop going to meetings?" I wanted so bad to say, hey dumbass, just think about what you just said. What do you think?????!)

    When I moved into the hall, I had specifically asked not to be reappointed as a MS. (I came with a letter of recommendation!). I wanted some time to deal with what was going on in the family, but was I left alone? Of course not. It seemed every meeting I was being harassed, asked to pick someone up, volunteer for a part, take on this, do that. It was unreal. I was basically a MS, but not in title. The only way I was left alone was when my wife and I did not report any time for one month (again, due to the family circumstance.) It was made very clear to me that my MS reappointment would be delayed because of that. (Which I asked not to be!! I tried to be forceful, while at the same time being "subject," as defiance wouldn't be Christian now, would it?) I was told I needed to get my time up, and be more productive in the ministry, even though they knew I was going through a lot, I still needed to put more effort into that. Oy! Nevermind the fact I barely had time to do anything else outside "the truth."

    Now, my wife is pregnant. So, in addition to my family responsibilities and both of us working full time, we are busy preparing for the big event!!! At the hall, I've been given a couple of MS responsibilities (even though I'm not a MS!). Yet I'm still being asked to do more. I even received a phone call at work last week, from my book study overseer, asking me where we have been the past couple of meetings (which we intentionally missed), and telling me that he wants me to help attend during the night of the Memorial. Of course, I said no since by then we'll have a newborn on our hands, and we'll want to be in and out, but then I'm rebuffed and told I should do it anyway. (Why do I have to fight with these guys all the time?) They make it so hard to turn down "spiritual assignments," and they go out of their way to guilt you for that. My book study overseer and his wife have also taken a very "special" interest in us. It's very clear he's trying to groom me for eldership (again, I'm not yet a MS, but whatever). And him and his wife, who are very "strong in the truth," are awkward, overbearing, and weird because of it, so needless to say they don't have that many friends, even within the org. Despite this, and the age difference, they've gravitated toward us. So not only do they see themselves as our close friends (which they're not but they seem convinced otherwise), he is the BS overseer so he uses the "friend" thing as an excuse to be all over us about stuff. It's kinda sad, so it's hard to fight agains bec I don't want to hurt any feelings.

    During this time, it's also become painfully obvious that many of our old friends from our old hall have pretty much moved on. We've only been gone for a year, and despite growing up with most of them, it's as if we never existed. I've always known most of them to be pretty shallow, but I didn't think THAT shallow. It's not a huge deal, as again we're pretty private people, and we socialize with folks from work and other folks. (Not like we have a huge social network outside the Witnesses, though.)

    Anyway, as I was saying at the beginning of this rant, my wife and I have talked quite a bit, and we've agreed we don't want to stay. Not only do we both have many reservations (many left unsaid over the years due to the though we might upset one another), I have many doctrinal issues, as well as the fact that I am done with this organization making so many unreasonable requests of time, just to be in OK standing. I barely have time to care for family obligations, work and personal time, nevermind the fact that I have a baby on the way. I am finding it to be much more of a challenge mentally and emotionally, and cannot stand to be around such closed-mindned, non-creative, self-righteous people, and exist in fear of them.

    However, the irony is despite my feelings, as well as the fact that I am the one that suggested leaving to my wife, I'm the one that's having a tough time actually going through with this...Don't get me wrong, with the meetings I've already missed, I'm loving the sweet freedom, both of thought, time, and real life. But's there's always complications.

    Here's what I'm dealing with. A month ago our hall threw us a beautiful baby shower. (Our old hall and other friends threw other separate showers!) We got so much stuff - it's almost wrong that we didn't have to pay for almost anything. They were very nice guestures. Of course, my wife and I want to leave the Witnesses, and I don't want to offend anyone in the process. We cant' bear to fade, so we really want to cut cold turkey. Yet, I don't want it to seem as if we stuck around just to take advantage of everyone's generosity. I'm not that kind of person, nor do I want to be perceived as such a person. Yet, because, of the way this org works, there's no honorable way to leave; without being thought of in this way. And of course everyone is wanting to see this baby after it's born. Great timing, huh? This is actually my biggest source of conention. Not sure why...

    And then there's the phone calls, visits, and stuff that I just don't want to deal with when we stop going to meetings. I'm harassed enough as it is today; I don't want to think how it's going to be once I stop attending for good. And due to the "spiritual" nature of this hall, I know they're not the type of elder body that will simply "give up."

    It's so funny that my wife (God bless her) seems much more gung ho about cutting cold turkey than I do, although I'm the one that brought it up the first place. Don't get me wrong, I just want it to end too, and realize that if I fade it may end up being worse (meetings in the back after every meeting, etc.). But I don't want to necessarily DA myself, or get DF'd. I just want to live my life, and close this particular chapter. I know, maybe I'm just a wuss and dont' want to deal with these inevitable repercussions.

    The last meeting we went to was last week Thursday (after missing a couple.) We skipped service on Saturday and skipped the Sunday meeting. (We've been able to deal with this bec of my wife being pregnant, so everyone is chalking up our absences due to her.) I did get a message from the PO on Saturday, not sure why, but I never returned the call. Now I know if I skip tonight's book study, the phone calls will start again. Some will be out of conern for my wife, but we just don't want to deal with this. So, in a way, I kinda see tonight's meeting as a turning point. We'll have missed a full week of meetings as of tonight, and that will really raise some red flags.

    So, is this really it? Should I stay or should I go tonight? Should I start the process now, or wait until later, like after the baby's born? Is this just a phase? Again, I don't want to upset or offend anyone (esp. with the baby shower thing), but I know people will get offended at some point anyway. At the same time, my wife and I just cannot fathom teaching our child any of this JW stuff that we were raised on.. In the end, neither of us really believe any of it. We also find going to the meetings to be very "painful." It's like I just can't take it anymore. I want to leave. I see myself leaving. Just how do I get there? It seems I don't have a problem leaving, it's just my unwillingness to hurt people. Either way, why is this so difficult? I've accepted this isn't the "truth," but should I keep going, just like so many other people who go to church but don't really believe? It's just so annoying. I really don't know what I'm asking, but what does everyone else think? What should I do? Why is this so hard? Why does this have such a grip on me? I wish I was never raised a JW. :(

  • Honesty
    Honesty

    Whatever you decide, do what is best for you.

    When I DA'd (I would have been called before a JC to answer charges of apostasy within a few weeks anyway, so what's the difference, right?) I immediately lost friends of 30 years. They scurry away like cockroaches when a light is turned on in the dark. They say awful things to non-JW's about me. They call me an idolator because I worship Jesus as my God.

    But it's all worth it because I am free and out of an abusive relationship with a false religious group that has absolutely nothing in common with Christianity.

    They are going to revile and villify you no matter how you make your exit because they have been taught that is the Christian thing to do.

  • rassillon
    rassillon

    First, Change your phone number.

    Continue to blame your wifes pregnency on missing meetings.

    Tell the elders when they ask that you are depressed and are seeing a therapist.

    Go to the hall occasionally, arrive late, leave early.

    After a year or so you should be able to stop going without too many questions.

    Rejoice that you have your wife, Mine did not take it so well, I am alone. But on the bright side I have no problem telling people who get in my personal business where to shove it and if they don't I will do it for them.

    Sorry for your situation, It is the nature of the beast.

    -r

  • truthsetsonefree
    truthsetsonefree
    They are going to revile and villify you no matter how you make your exit because they have been taught that is the Christian thing to do.

    This is ABSOLUTELY true. Which means that your exit is best decided by what works best for you and your family.

    tsof

  • RAF
    RAF

    I don't know what you should do (you know what you want ... and will get there in a way or an other ... they are not you, they have made their own choice to believe and to be faithfull to this organisation it doesn't have to be a burden for you, it doesn't allow them to mind your business, since you have the right to make your own choices) but I'm happy for you that both you and your wife agree (it'll ease the whole process).

    Take care ... I wish you the best for you and your family

  • TheMan
    TheMan

    You know, you're absolutely right. Here I am sitting here upset bec I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, yet they're going to think of me the same way in the end.

    Thanks for the tips & words of encouragement. If anyone else has more tips or thoughts, I'm all ears. After writing my post, I feel much better about what I want to do. I guess I needed to get it all out.

    I know this was long, so thanks for listening. It really helps.

  • J-ex-W
    J-ex-W

    First: Congratulations on your expected baby!

    Second: Welcome to the forum.

    Third: Nothing 'wussy' about it at all.... (not wanting to deal with 'repercussions' for deciding to leave--shouldn't HAVE to deal with that...that's the insane thing about it all!)

    I know you're concerned about hurt feelings and bad opinions about the gifts if/ when you leave, but consider this: That pales in comparison to the bad opinions they will have about your leaving, PERIOD. The gifts thing matters little beside the 'bad heart condition' that LEAVING the org. implies in their eyes.

    There...doesn't that make the ungrateful-about-the-gifts impression seem a little minor, now? No one is going to sit back and say, Well...at least they waited a few months after the shower before leaving. Leaving any sooner would have just been bad manners.

    They aren't going to have a charitable or balanced view of you/ your wife/ your decisions WHICHEVER way you go...so make the decision that works best for you and your wife.

    A round of sincere thank you notes is all the attention to those gifts that is necessary. It's your young, growing family that deserves your full attention now. Good luck to you...and remember...you're TheMan! You can get through this. And we're here to support.

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    Many will have an opinion, but it's all up to you. It sounds like you are hanging back for
    "friends." They will cut you off eventually anyway. It sounds like you are ready to go
    because you don't like the hassle of dealing with the elders. Anything short of a clear
    Disassociation will get you more hassle.

    It seems you have three choices.

    1. Continue to fade quickly, don't respond to the elders much. Allow the friends to slowly get
    the idea that you are weak. Deal with the hassle as much as you can.

    2. Fade using Rassillon's suggestions- at least some of them.

    3. Totally Disassociate yourself. You can just ignore the elders or give them a letter. Just stop
    going to meetings and taking any calls.

    Since you have some family in, it might be easier to do #1 or #2, but your BOE will be all over you.
    You gotta decide your moves.

  • JamesThomas
    JamesThomas
    I want to leave. I see myself leaving. Just how do I get there? It seems I don't have a problem leaving, it's just my unwillingness to hurt people. Either way, why is this so difficult?

    So, leave.

    Stop worrying about other peoples reactions. You are not hurting people. They are hurting themselves; they will hurt because you are not what they want you to be....and this IS NOT YOUR PROBLEM.

    Get off the fence, leave, and let the chips fall where they may. Be true to yourself and your family.

    Focus more on the present moment with your family, and give less attention to the mind's drama concerning what others are going to think about it.

    j

  • willyloman
    willyloman

    I related to your story on many levels. My journey "out" was very similar. My wife and I finally had "the talk"and were both relieved to be on the same page. We had family and business ties to consider. We changed congregations, twice. We quit pretty much cold turkey. That was three years ago. No regrets. We're very happy with our decision.

    My best advice: Create an exit strategy. I don't mean think about what the next steps are: Write them down! Actually come up with a plan on how you get out of there in one piece. In my case, after moving to another congo for about a year - and experiencing exactly what you did, the initial love-bombing followed by a heavy dose of busy-bodiness - we changed congos again. One of things that propelled us forward was that my wife came down with a serious illness. It was one of those things for which there is no cure, but which sometimes goes away by itself. After a month or so, she started to get better. We decided not to tell anyone she was getting better. This illness gave us "cover" for missing a lot of meetings and for me stepping "aside" as an elder (I was conducting the WT study).

    At one point we had not been to a meeting for at least three weeks. One Sunday morning my wife looked up from her newspaper and, sipping her coffee, said: "Are we ever going to the Hall again?" I thought about it and said, "Nope." She continued to read her paper. The subject never came up again, and we never set foot in another KH.

    We thought about changing our phone number, but that was too difficult for many reasons so we bought a new phone machine. It had one of those synthesized voices on it ("No one can come to the phone right now, leave a message"). We got a lot of hang-ups but almost no messages - I think people were confused that it wasn't one of our voices on the machine and they weren't sure they'd reached the right number. Either that, or no one called us. A few dubs eventually did leave messages. We just deleted them.

    It was remarkable, looking back on it, how few genuine efforts were made to reach us. Lots of dubs knew where we lived. In the three years we've been AWOL, only one person has come by the house to look in on us, and that was probably two years ago. They do avoid us in stores and malls, of course, which is just fine with us. There are times we run face to face into old dub "friends" and we are sure to be gracious but determined to grant no interviews. That hasn't been difficult, because no one wants an interview! It's as if they are too afraid to ask us what happened, for fear it will contaminate them (or, more likely, bring their own doubts to the surface).

    Anyway, I could go on but you get the idea. Best of luck on your journey, my friend. Be courageous.

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