Please Focus on the Bible (page 2)

DJS

Perry!!!

Great to see you. I was afraid you had linked yourself so closely to Abiathar(sssss) that you might stay gone for a while. I've missed you!

OnTheWayOut

If I am reading this right, Moses wrote a fairy-tale because the people needed a lesson and were not going to get there with the actual truth of creation, yet they wanted a creation story.

So are we still as backwards as the goat-herder former slaves of Egypt? We can't handle the truth? Shouldn't maybe God issue a retraction of Genesis and maybe leave a monolith on the moon with the actual story written on it (kind of like in 2001: A Space Odyssey) or is He saying "Sorry, Dave. I can't do that!" ? Or in our modern age where we are able to handle more, shouldn't God just put it in our minds how things came to be? Or something else besides a fairy-tale stolen from ignorant cultures to appease more ignorant people.

And whoever wrote the words accredited to Jesus that the world would never "again" be destroyed by flood was just guessing and will be ultimately right because science has amply demonstrated how the story could not have been true in the first place and it could never happen, not the first time and not a second time. I think most people can figure out that the worlds "As in the days ....took them all away" mean that God is going to destroy you all if you don't kiss his ass, not by flood but just the same. It's just a throwback to the God of Armies of the OT.

As long as we are there, if the creation story is a fairy tale stolen from other cultures to appease ignorant people and just teach an object lesson, couldn't the flood be a fairy tale with the same purpose?

Bugbear

Perry…

I am not aware of the existence of god. But I must say that I am aware of the non- existence of any god or goddesses. The proof for my theory is very simple, if god is good and merciful, gentle and forgiving, loving , how can he let his bellowed children suffer on this earth. How can he/she? Just leave his children to slaughter one another. How can he create viruses, cancer, earth cracks, tsunamis and so on and on and on…….

The absence of gods was discussed from the 1600 th centuries in the so called enlightenment period. And it is still difficult for humans to understand fully the consequences of this insight. Religious leaders, from most of the existing cultural or “great” religions are scared to death that their followers in a greater extend will understand these consequences. These “black coat, darkness men” will lose all their respect, all influence, all their bank accounts, and all their prestige, when the rest of the world will find them as frauds.

Humans are predators. And as predators on the topmost level, regardless of what “wholly book” we prefer to believe in, we kill and slaughter each other in a scale that is frightening.

My dogs, my cats, my sheep’s, seems to have a much higher standard of moral and ethics, then , the “average” humans that interpret The “wholly books”, or listen to those who claim that the know the will of god.

Bugbear

terrypike

Hi Cofty, I am not biting so don't go there and anyway I am old enough to have lost most of my teeth and learnt something about the value of human dignity.

Thanks Carm, It is not our culture that is at stake here but our souls: are there not good and not so good souls in every culture? ultimately you are right of course it comes down to how we apply what our culture teaches to work out our own salvation and that's the basis for our souls reward come our judgement day, what price then will a man give for his soul when it is valued according to its works by the standard God sets for mankind.

Perhaps Perry would like to comment about this as I may be making assumptions about the role of Jesus and on what basis he seperate's the sheep from the goats..would a belief in the resurrection of Jesus be the work that justifies the soul eternally (Abraham was justified by faith) are those the works of the new creature/soul who has the mind of Christ..or should I put the emphasis on the lifelong growth of faith and the wisdom to work things out in the spirit of truth...that brings me back to my first post which reminds me...

Half banana

Terrypike, clearly you want to defend the Bible and you have every right to chose that course but the Bible has already had a reign of 1500 years, yet only since the philosophical Enlightenment of the late eighteenth century has it been realised that the Bible is not justifiably “holy”. It has always been used as a tool for political control, overtly by the Roman Church and its contents have simply been assumed to be true. What a mistake!

This was challenged and refuted in the middle of the nineteenth century by textual scholarship and by scientists notably Darwin whose thesis of speciation by natural selection put paid forever amongst educated people, the possibility of a literal interpretation of the Bible creation account in Genesis. Since then scientific research continues to destroy the holiness of the Bible texts. Therefore if you want a serious argument you cannot possibly quote the Bible as an authority. You must find historical references backed up by first hand reporting and unambiguous archaeological evidence. Religious sources are hopelessly biased since they promote “faith” not evidence. Their function is to give emotional support for the downtrodden but never is evidential based fact called upon; simply the call to believe. Belief is cultivated and succoured by the imagination, knowledge however comes from evidence.

The fact that the Bible character Jesus is attributed with words endorsing the Biblical flood (which event was impossible) just demonstrates that Jesus is no authority and that the Bible is a waste of time for finding serious knowledge. Literature: yes it most certainly is, factual: no.

Viviane

It is not our culture that is at stake here but our souls: are there not good and not so good souls in every culture

What is a soul? What is it made of? Where is it located in the body?

Finkelstein

I called this post please focus on the Bible.

I am, the point one should accept is that the writings in the bible or the Quran or the Torah were done so thousands of years ago, by subjectively ignorant people, humanity has used some of those inspired writings for the good of humanity but as well a lot adverse detrimental effects from following everything of what is written in those old texts.

How is it possible or can you possibly remove the known bad detrimental writings.

Humanity has learned much more about himself and the world in which we live in, since the sociological era of those ancient religious practices.

terrypike

Hi Finkelstein, Thanks for your comment which reminded me about the 1972 restoration of the great Mosque of Sana'a in Yemin, in brief a German scholar visited the place and was invited to look at what is known as a' paper grave' meaning that Othodox Muslims respectfully keep old worn out scripts often laid to rest in the roof space, there were tens of thousands of fragments from about a thousand different Koran, some of those fragment showed distinct differences from the standard text of the Koran.

These were examined in 1981 and since then it has been found that they were sheets of scripture written in the early hijazi text which made them peaces of the earliest Korans known to exist, the full article is several pages long by Tony Lester called What is the Koran?

I mention this because the German Government funded much of the research I have not kept up to date about this but do find it interesting in that Germany now has a powerful voice in Europe once again and has obtained the documented evidence that could argue a step change in Islamic understanding of the Koran at a time when Muslim leaders are not best pleased with the extremes of there religion.

Terry

cofty

that's the basis for our souls reward come our judgement day, what price then will a man give for his soul when it is valued according to its works by the standard God sets for mankind. - Terry

God's standards are vastly inferior to mine.

Unlike Yahweh I don't condone slavery, misogyny, kidnap, rape, infanticide and homophobia.

Jesus enticed married men to abandon their wives, children and livelihoods to follow him around spreading false apocalyptic prophecies.

If there is a god, and if there is to be a judgement day, he better have some good excuses.

Viviane

Germany now has a powerful voice in Europe once again and has obtained the documented evidence that could argue a step change in Islamic understanding of the Koran at a time when Muslim leaders are not best pleased with the extremes of there religion.

There's about as a much of a chance of that as there is Christians admitting their holy book is full of contradictions and nonsense.

Both are factually true, but it doesn't matter because these people don't value facts and logic.

Please Focus on the Bible

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