Some good comments here ,and WINNIE is sensitized to the issue of respect here for we had the ANZAC day holiday here ,and as the old timer vets pass away it's surprising here ,to me , that so many young people are celebrating the memory of those that fought at sites like Gallipoli.
There always seems to me that there is a lack of balance when considering war and those who have fought and the reasons are as complex as life itself. There seems to be extremes in viewpoints like the JW one, and then there's the redneck patriot type, and then there's all the others in the middle troubling to polarize around the different viewpoints.
Look at Patriotism - it seems to have a life of it's own and is a result of emotions led by certain factions in the community that are justifying their agenda ,and I would say sneer equally at JW thinking as much as JW's disdain the patriotic. The faction here that has great sway with the media ,politicians etc is the Returned Soldiers League and it's usually headed by a red necked loud buffon that is desperate to paint every Australian act of war and the people that went as servicemen as just heroic and that's all. Never mind the desperately miserable failures of the leaders of the military who sent kids to be killed like at Gallipoli. These wastes of life are never honestly discussed ,it's just like all the length of a war is bundelled into one picture and let's not discect it to see if we made stupid and cruel errors ,and never ever expose what really caused this war in the first place ,but let's just focus on the ones who died bravely or came back and let time make them all heroes.
I think that's what's going on and always has ,and people are desperate to somehow justify the loss of their family members to war and the misery that follows on. That's what the other extreme viewpoint JW's only focus on ,and ignore that sometimes people have to fight to truly defend themselves and their loved ones.
When one has to decide whether to back a war ,we as citizens are fed bullshit as to the real reasons the war started and usually it took some time for the hatred to form ,and it is usually for the reasons of money,religion and politics....in other words self interest. So the Watchtower might be right to a degree but then the red neck has a genuine reason to defend if a genuine threat is imminent. But who is to say when a just war comes along? It really should be up to us as an individual and not forced on us thru politicians on the one hand or forced on us thru threat of disfellowshipping by the extreme views of a governing body of mere men.
This is my take on it ,and what has lead me to my thinking is this - My father was RAF in England in WW11 for the entire war yet he became a pacifist which I did'nt fully agree. The horror he experienced is common to many vets and perhaps his was worse than many and that may have lead him to his future opinion of war and he detested the glory painted on vets.
When I was 17 I joined the Australian Navy of the Vietnam war times at his disgust, but I went, and I really had no clue what I was getting into ,but I found out soon enough in training. So young and stupid ,like alot of others who fought and died ,but we made a decision based on ignorance of reality when we had'nt lived long enough to mature and work out who we were in life . Well when I'd done some nuclear warfare training it finally dawned on me that the weapons at our disposal were to kill ,unlike the movies, and I discovered within myself that I was not a paid killer and saw the eyes of the other side that my father told me about ,who were just people like me SO WHO THE HELL IS TELLING ME TO KILL THEM AND WHY?
No one in the service wanted to tell me and in time I resigned as a conscientious objector ,which became a war in itself. Never regretted that decision .and though many people never came back from Vietnam and I was safe ,I still have no regrets, for over time I saw the disrespect the returnees got when they came home and the mental damage done by this rejection still is carried by them today. The Returned Soldiers League and media today give them postive attention these days , but back in the 70's a different story and I believe that alot of Australians are still a bit skeptical at sending troops to just any war ,what a cost .
I have been in mental hospital with vets and it's a sorry picture, talking to one guy who poured out to me about the order to kill villagers ,and the horror of him killing close range some women and children, I'll never forget his face. I said I got out as an conscientious objector and he said it was the best thing to do.
When I was a witness years after some brothers would be shocked and shun me for declaring that if someone threatened the well being of my family in my home I would not hesitate to cut them down. It's not popular but to me it's balanced thinking, the same as showing respect, but not glorifying ,vets for some are not happy with what they chose to, or were forced to do.
Gods word points out on one occaision that some men were looked over for military service because of their nature ,but others fought for him so god knows we need to defend ourselves in certain circumstances, that was even part of the Law.
On the other hand look at that interview that famous American interviewer did, when he asked the politicians how many of their children were going to war in Iraq he could only find one or two who had ......same world as always ,different standards for different classes of people so get your troops from the getto. We all are left to make our own mature and informed choice.
