"They don't even know what they believe!" -- JW

by AlmostAtheist 12 Replies latest jw friends

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  AlmostAtheist

  A JW once said (more than once, probably) in regards to members of other faiths, "They don't even know what they believe!" I know that's a legitimate quote from a real JW because I'm the one that said it. I often found that the people I met in field service would claim to be a Catholic or a Methodist or whatever, but wouldn't have a clue about the beliefs of their church. I assumed they were either lying -- just naming a church they happened to know -- or they were only a nominal member of it.

  Such arrogance! I assumed at the time that since being a good JW meant believing everything the Watchtower said, being a Catholic or a Lutheran or whatever else required something similar. It's hard to really get the idea that a person can happily call themselves a Catholic, while strongly supporting birth control.

  But it's true. Because very few religions actually force conformity upon their members. The JW's call it unity, but that has a voluntary connotation that just doesn't apply. It's conformity, or maybe even closer to uniformity.

  I thought those folks in other religions were "weak", but in forging their own paths, they actually showed their strength. I looked up my "faith" in the Watchtower Index -- that takes strength of will, maybe, but not strength of godly faith. They really walked with their god. I walked in lockstep with an organization that claimed to be my god-proxy.

  I feel ashamed now, to think that I dared to deride their faith, when my own was so artificial. JW's are truly an arrogant, arrogant group.

  Dave
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  carla

  Good post. I know a cult expert of sorts who tried to refuse to tell my jw which 'religion' he was just for the reasons you stated. My jw being a good persistent jw finally weasled it out of the guy. Why was he so persistent? So he could badmouth his denomination instead trying to focus on the bible only. The cult guy just kept trying to get back to the bible but my jw just had no real interest in that! At that meeting I realized his brain was already gone, freely given to the cult.
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  The wanderer

  Dear Dave:
  
  Personally, I do not think it is so much the Jehovah's
  Witnesses fault per se. I would attribute that arrogance
  from the corporation that started it all namely, The
  Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.
  
  To me Jehovah's Witnesses are a misled people who have
  an organization do the thinking, leading and directing
  of all the affairs in their lives.
  
  By the way, Dave I like your thread posts.
  
  Respectfully,
  
  The Wanderer
• 

  zack

  Very true. JW's DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY BELIEVE. I mentioned to my wife this week that the FDS demands submission as a condition to salvation and she was adamant that

  that wasn't true. She had gone to the Watchtower study and I specifically called out the paragraph to her where they said it was a "christian's sacred duty" to obey the FDS.

  She insisted that wasn't what the paragraph meant, even though it was clearly one of many paragraphs in the same study article demanding, although with sophistry and subtlety,

  obedience from the flock to them if the flock wanted salvation. I could so clearly see the brainwashing. It was frightening. I had to beg off from our chat because I was so stunned. I had

  thought I was making progress.
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  Amber Rose

  Yes Almost Athiest, I know exactly what you are saying. I have heard and said those same words with such arrogance, and feel the same shame today. Looking back, I find it funny how many JWs ask "What do we believe about...". Sad when a person can not decied for himself what he believes.
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  Scully

  There were also times when I noticed that other JWs didn't even know what they believed. I knew some old-timers who used to use terminology that was common back in the Rutherford and/or early Knorr eras. Interested People™ were called Men of Goodwill™. Circuit Overseers™ were called Circuit Servants™. Auxiliary Pioneers™ were called Vacation Pioneers™. The list could go on for days, I imagine.

  Then you had the JWs who couldn't grasp the so-called historical application of prophecy. I spent an entire summer memorizing the steps on how JWs arrived at the 607 BCE - 1914 CE, the 2,520 years, the scriptures that supposedly applied to it, etc. It really bugged me that there were JWs who just "accepted" that the Faithful and Discreet Slave™ knew what they were doing, but were unwilling to really try to understand. How on earth could they ever "defend their faith" if called upon to do so?? I felt soooo ready!! I knew the scriptural basis for refusing blood transfusions - I was 12 years old - and totally felt that I was ready to stand in front of a judge and explain why I believed it would be wrong for me to accept a blood transfusion. I wasn't one of those JWs who would falter and show a sign of doubt. I believed what I believed because I was prepared, dammit!

  Actually, it was probably that same drive to be ready to defend my beliefs that led me to where I am now. Go figure.
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  StillGroggy

  AlmostAtheist,
  
  I've been thinking about this sort of thing alot lately. I agree with you that JWs are an arrogant bunch, although i partially believe some of what the wanderer says about it.
  
  I DO think that the environment created by the WTs teachings IS one of arrogance, despite the fact that they say it is out of love. How many times do you hear JWs refer to non-JWs as "Some Worldy guy" They basically use it as a racial slur! I've always felt that JWs regard non-JWs as a lower class of human being.
  
  Look in the revelation book, in the upcoming weeks there is a picture of an angel killing wicked "worldly" people. The worldy people are portrayed as a bunch of violent animals. My wife won't share a cup with the "worldly" people at work because she sees them as a promiscuous, diseased bunch!
  
  Although many JWs claim they have "empathy" for worldly people, when was the last time most of them gave any money to a charity other than the WT? From what I've seen, MOST DONT.
  
  However, There are some people in the JWs who ABSOLUTELY LOVE looking down on non-JWs. They gain a self-satisfaction, it makes them feel like they are part of an elite. Many elders and pioneers take on this persona. I believe this has to do with their personality, and if they belonged to any other cult, they would be the SAME WAY.
  
  - SG
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  johnny cip

  i know the jw drill well. and i never admitt to being a menber of any religion. and only say i'm a follower of christ. and know how to use the rule of if two come together in christs name he is with them. and bring the jw' right back to the question of the wt. i have so much practice cutting off dub think before they even state it. i throw a MONKEY WRENCH into everything they try to put over. after they try a few conversation stoppers. and find they are getting no where. but embarrassed they get pissed and walk away. and trust me i never forget to let them know they don't even know what they believe
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  AlmostAtheist

  Thanks for your thoughts, folks. Good stuff here.

  Just to clarify, my point is that people believe whatever they want to believe, whether they assume the label of "Catholic" or "Methodist" or whatever. The JW's -- while often not knowing the official doctrine -- are expected to at least ACCEPT the current teachings, or they simply are not JW's. (Even to the point of being announced as such, if they press it.)

  The independant thinkers among the churches who decide for themselves what they believe, regardless of their church's official doctrine, have my respect. And for that matter, those among JW's that thumb their nose at the Watchtower and privately believe as they wish have a measure of my respect as well.

  And I agree that the arrogance of the looking-down-their-nosedness of JW's is inherited from their Mother Organization. Amazingly, they feel humble, despite this raging arrogance. The responsibility for this character flaw is largely in the Watchtower's lap, agreed.

  Dave
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  aquagirl

  i hate when the dubs make fun of other religions,like the hindus and the cow thing,when they themselves are the most ridiculous of all...they have theri heads up thier %%& so far that they will never see the real truth..i wonder tho,how is it that there are new ones being made everyday?,is it just the societys rejects that want to be a part of something/anything?so they will be a dub?i just dont understand..