144,000

TIMBOB

This is not so much a question as it is to make sure that I am thinking correctly.

The witnesses believe that 144,000 would rule as kings and priests in heaven and the end would not come until all of the 144,000 were in heaven, correct?

So, if this were the case and the witnesses kept a census of how many partook each year and are still doing that today, that means that back in the early 1900’s they must of known that all 144,000 were not yet in heaven.

Again, if this is true, then why would there have been even a consideration of predicting the end in 1914,15,25,75?

This just kind of popped in my head and I am just seeing if this makes any sense to anyone else?

eclipse

The witnesses believe that 144,000 would rule as kings and priests in heaven and the end would not come until all of the 144,000 were in heaven, correct?

If my memory serves me correctly, and they have changed this doctrine a few times, I believe, but last I remembered, whover wasn't dead of the 144,000 were either gonna be wisked up to heaven at armegeddon...I think they used to teach that the remaining remnant would help out the armegeddon survivors, but I think they changed that to them being taken up to heaven either right before armegeddon or sometimes...the details are foggy....

I think that is why they continued to prophesy dates, it didn't matter how many remnant were left...jehober would take them when he felt like it..

ithinkisee

Eclipse is right. After they came up with the concept of 144,000 and later the great crowd (when the numbers of JWs grew over 144,000) it was proclaimed they would be whisked away to heaven at Armageddon if any were still alive.

But you have to remember they didn't believe in two groups at the time - they only believed in one group of people up until the numbers of JWs grew over 144000 and the end still hadn't come. Back in the early 1930's Rutherford anticipated rapid growth of the organization and visualized the membership rising beyond 144,000. This would complicate the original doctrine of only 144,000 people being candidates for citizenship in heaven. They had to come up with some sort of explanation - which is where they strayed from Jesus teaching of "one group, one faith" and made two classes of Christians. In 1935 at the District Convention Rutherford announced that anyone becoming a JW today would compose an Earthly Class.(excerpted from MacGregor Ministries)

So regarding why they predicted the end? Well they still had less than 144,000 total witnesses at the time. ANd they figured that other Bible Students throughout history since 33CE made up the difference. So predicting the end in 1914, 1918, 1925, 1935, 1941,1975,2034 etc is really nothing more than them speculating and keeping the "carrot" in front of people's noses.

-ithinkisee

OnTheWayOut

They currently teach that there may be remnant on the earth. They may just live awhile and die after
Armageddon because God won't revive their flesh to youth, so they could go to heaven.

I've learned that loopholes in JW logic only help people that are ready for them. They make perfectly
logical reasons to question the WTS, but JW's are used to ignoring perfect logic.

WTS could easily tabulate an approximate number of the anointed in the last 80 years or so. And if
these folks really were "appointed by Jehovah" to such greatness and responsibilities, the WTS would
keep tabs on them and get their input on PRESENT TRUTH. They are obviously a fairy tale from
the real leaders.

Marcel

the current doctrine is that they arent sure whether ppl of the 144000 will on earth while armageddon. it may be or may not.

most of the doctrines had changed since that many disappointments of the last century that i think they are changing it in that way that the final product will be nearly timeless. no dates, no countdowns, just a static "urgent" attitude which gives you the impression that armageddon is tomorrow all the time.

over the time even 1914 will die. 100%

TIMBOB

Thanks fo replies. Guess my thinking was a little wrong on what the witnesses beleived with all of that. It clears up the confusion though.

cultswatter

The 144,000 is going to go symbolic - a sure bet

aniron

After they came up with the concept of 144,000 and later the great crowd (when the numbers of JWs grew over 144,000)

Did Charles Russell on founding the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society / International Bible Students Association from 1870's.

Really think he would only have 144,000 members?

greendawn

When did they decide that the number 144 000 was literal, rather than symbolic as is the verse in which it is found? On the other hand yes the dubs were expecting the rapture of the church that would take them to heavens in 1914 as in 1878. Two vain expectations.

OnTheWayOut

The 144,000 is going to go symbolic - a sure bet

I am hoping they do go symbolic. I will exploit this major change
to point out the nonsense of the organization.

144,000

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