by proplog2 31 Replies latest jw friends
This a double-edged sword for them, lose-lose, damned-if-they-do-damned-if-they-don't.
If they leak, and they do, that contributions are down, some will see it as evidence of a lack of divine blessing.
If they leak. and they do, that the Tower is financially strong, some will see no need to sacrifice too much of their personal resources.
Either way, as many have noted, contributions are way down.
nvrgnbk
OK. So we should basically believe that contributions are way down because we "feel" they are way down.
It seems the two hardest things for people to say is "I don't know" and "I guess I was wrong".
sspo: Most people donate around 2.5% for religion. That's the basis for handing out shares of taxes in countries that contribute to religion.
nvrgnbk
OK. So we should basically believe that contributions are way down because we "feel" they are way down.
It seems the two hardest things for people to say is "I don't know" and "I guess I was wrong".
sspo: Most people donate around 2.5% for religion. That's the basis for handing out shares of taxes in countries that contribute to religion.
Here's the deal proplog2.
I worked in the "financial" end of things with the WT.
I've been hearing, for years now, that contributions are down.
I've been hearing, for years now, that the Organization is sitting well financially.
I merely made an observation about how both "spins" could have adverse effects on donations.
As sspo said, contributions are down at the local level. I've heard no different from anyone, anywhere.
At the Special and Two day assembly we would have an elder's meeting during the lunch break and the account servant would go over the contributions i.e we are donating x amount of $ to the needs of the circuit overseer, x amount $ to the needs of the circuit, x amount $ to the world wide work.etc. The he would tell us we have a deficit of x amount of $ dollars to secure the present use of the assembly hall. We would all vote by a show of hands, all in favor, to take the money that the rank and file donated and parcel it out as they see fit.
After the lunch break, there would be an announcement to the circuit about how loving we are to support the Governing Body with our financial donations, however, we have a deficit of x amount of $. i.e $900.20.03. Exactly, this would sound very official to the penny.
And that's how they get their hand in your pocket.
Blueblades
As to the evidence, it is right there in front of our faces. The WTS depended for years on the donation for the literature. Cost 2 1/2 cents for the magazine and the publisher pays 25 cents up front. A steady, reliable stream of cash into the coffers of the WTS that ended in 1990 in the US and by 2000 the rest of the world. Now 7 years later the WTS is feeling the pinch, property rich and cash poor. The monies that come in from the conventions/assemblies do not begin to pay the cost of maintaining the large buildings and facilities the WTS owns and operates, let alone the machinery and the cost of housing, feeding, and clothing 5,000 Bethelites worldwide.
Blondie worked for an institution with many large buildings and knows what it costs to maintain them. It is not the initial cost but the operating costs that bury such institutions. The selling off of land and property to me is evidence that cash flow is slowing down more and more. The WTS invests in the financial market which has been iffy in the last few years. Is the WTS dipping into capital to keep things going until the end comes soon, soon, soon.
Blondie
There was a thread started by JWfacts (I think) not so long ago where it was stated that official figures released by the Society showed that donations in Australia last year were about 33% down.
Well then, I don't have exact reference but I'm pretty sure that either Russel or Rutherford had said that when money stops coming in that will be the sign that Jehvoah has stopped giving his blessing. I wonder what they would say about that now :)
Just as I thought. No one knows for a certainty.
Like all non-profits it is to their advantage to have their contributors "believe" that their situation is dire.
We all cut costs on things that don't make a significant difference. Soft cover books are NOT a sign that the Watchtower is folding.
Cheap (and crappy) convention facilities are NOT a sign that the Watchtower can't afford it. It is more likely that the accountants are doing their jobs just like the lawyers.
Selling off property that no longer serves its purpose is NOT a sign that the Watchtower is in decline. They are a printing company and they have some pretty fancy equipment. Presses have always been their pride and joy.
Their money is probably going into the branches.
Without published USA accounts , we can only surmise somewhat. The only tangible evidence that I have seen is in the UK accounts which show fairly much a flat-line of 20 million UKP income for the last 7 years... http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/registeredcharities/showcharity.asp?remchar=&chyno=1077961
Canadian and Australian figures are broadly similar.
A study going further back indicated that there was approx a 25% fall-off when the "paid for" literature arrangement stopped , though this did recover somewhat.
Anecdotally , my understanding is that the income in the USA is broadly the same over the same period (ie no increase but no decrease in overall contributions). While direct donations have gone down slightly , this has been made up by legacies ,as a result of increasing equity and property values. In the UK in 2006 , total income was approx 7.6 million UKP donations and 3.8 million UKP legacies.
The WTS really needs to increase income or cut costs by about 5% per annum. In the absence of the former , the WTS have achieved the latter. Their main costs are newsprint , which hasn't really moved for the last ten years , and fuel which has increased considerably. The recent cost cutting measures (Bethel lay-offs , selling of buildings , WT & Awake on a monthly basis etc) have reduced their cost base considerably.
Having done this , the main issue that the WTS needs to address is the vast amount of literature virtually "given away" in the 3rd world. I'm advised that is the main reason behind the plethora of "special tract campaigns".
Well, prolog and dozy, if you two both think the WTS would reveal this info from the platform or at a meeting or convention, you have smoking too much weed. And if you think that the info on molesters in the WTS is safely guarded, the financial info even more so. I spent time with a Bethelite who admitted though he worked in the financial end fairly high up, few knew the full picture of the financial standings of the WTS.
As to selling off property, that was not the only point. The point is that it takes a substantial cash flow to maintain large institutional buildings and equipment. A building is initially built that costs $40,000,000; then costs $40,000,000 a year to maintain and operate. As time goes by the building even with upkeep, starts to drain the company as repairs, remodeling, upkeep gets more and more expensive. Yes, I dealt with $40,000,000 buildings (25 of them) and the capital budget every 2 years.
As to donating to the WTS, estates, etc., if you were to try and prove that by the jws I have known over the last 50 years, few donate at all and definitely not all. We hear about the ones that donate everything and cut off their family, even the jw ones, because they howl the loudest. I know of jws that have contested wills where the family member had cut them out. After failing to shame and guilt these people, the WTS gave up their quest for the almighty dollar, taler, etc., in that case.
What I do see is where they loan money for investing under the non-profit corporation arrangement and get a tax benefit. But they do not give the money to the WTS.
The WTS is like the aircraft carrier, huge and cumbersome in bureaucracy. From the time the skipper says change course to this, it takes ten miles to see a change. Counting down from 2000, we still have 3 years (ten year cycle) to see what else financially changes.
Now if you guys need a balance sheet with assets on one side and liabilities on the other...why not call WTS and see if they will send one out.
| Watchtower Bible & Tract Society of NY Inc 25 Columbia Heights Brooklyn, NY 11201 |
| 718-560-5000 |
