I'm Ready... Thank you

by Garrett 47 Replies latest jw friends

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  done4good

  rebel8- I will clarify this.

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    rebel8 13 hours ago

    I would be interested in getting clarification on what is meant by this.

    I never bought into the "it is playing by their rules argument". Most who say this are really pretty much faking it

    Faking what?
    

    it is equally as judgmental to claim "playing by their rules"

    Why do you view this as judgmental? DA is their religious ritual; voluntarily participating in it is playing by their rules. This is just a statement of fact, not judgment.
    

    when they don't know your personal reasons for DA). I did gain great peace of mind from it

    I can't imagine many personal reasons. Is my list missing anything?

    1. Expressing your feelings/beliefs to your former cultmates by use of a cult ritual (their rules).

    2. Seeking a sense of closure by forcing the cult grant it to you (their rules).

    3. Any variation on #2--getting some sort of catharsis by participating in the cult ritual of DA (their rules).

    4. Utilizing a cult ritual (their rules) to cut off contact from your former cultmates.

    5. Seeking punishment (their rules).

    Anyone who wants to play by their rules is free to do so. That's the beauty of the freedom you now have.

    Statement of fact says who? I would really like to know who the authority is on this???
    

    I agree that is not necessary to DA. In fact, I was quite opposed to the idea, (even to the point of using the same rationale, (playing by their rules), until I simply realized that that my principal reason for not doing so were my own fears of others knowing my true thoughts on the WTS. Once I realized that, I realized there was a lack of honesty on my part, and I was doing others a disservice by the lack of clarity and evasiveness.

    In the end, it is their choice to shun me based on my decision to make it clear that I was no longer a JW, not mine. DA is simply making a statement I am no longer JW. "Playing by their rules" is choosing to treat a person who did so according to WTS edict.

    Many, many will automatically choose to assume a person who DA did so out of some innate need to conform to WTS "rules". For the life of me, I cannot imagine why that is knowing what I know now. I was out for 18 months by the time I DA. Not a single meeting, little to no association with JW, and not really concerned that some elders or others were going to try to convert me back. What I believed was that I owed the few folks I considered friends in the org. to know the truth. That is why I also put my letter on this forum and signed my real name to it.

    Having said that, let me also clarify my statement on "faking it", (in the form of a question). Who do you think appears to be more under WTS control, someone honest enough to state their view publicly, or someone who pretends to still be JW who does not believe any of it? Who really is playing by WTS rules more? Think about it. It is often these same ones who are the most vocal about how much someone is playing by WTS rules is, if they DA.

    d4g
    
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  Gentledawn

  In the end, it is their choice to shun me based on my decision to make it clear that I was no longer a JW, not mine. DA is simply making a statement I am no longer JW. "Playing by their rules" is choosing to treat a person who did so according to WTS edict.

  When they announce a person as 'disassociated' they make no specific difference between that and disfellowshipping. The dishonesty all around is on the watchtower leadership, every goddamned time.

  Me? I DA'd. People at the hall still tell my husband that they said hello and want to go out for coffee or what-not.

  ^ That is not the norm. My thinking is they're trying to appease my husband in some way.

  In fact, when i wasn't attending meetings prior to my DA letter, they didn't call or come around to the house whatsoever. <-- THAT is the norm.

  If you don't attend meetings, that is a "sign" of your spiritual state. What a load of hooey-manure, as Bugs Bunny would say.

  In my opinion, it doesn't matter if you DA or not. If you don't slave away for the so-called "SLAVE" (aka leadership, the true publishers, and all their enforcers down the chain of command), then they will shun you anyway.
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  SAHS

  “done4good”: “Who do you think appears to be more under WTS control, someone honest enough to state their view publicly, or someone who pretends to still be JW who does not believe any of it?”

  Well said!! My thoughts exactly.
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  Splash

  If you DA yourself the announcement is the same as a DF, "xxx is no longer a JW".

  The Cong recoil in fear, you are the topic of conversation for a week with all kinds of rumours, then they run ever more from your presence.
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  rebel8

  It is a fact that disassociation is a religious ritual of jws. It is a fact that you voluntarily participated in it.
  

  This statement of fact requires no authority--it is simply a fact we all know is true, including you.

  Your reasons for doing so do not change the fact that it is a religious ritual you participated in. If you are enthusiastic about it, great--why not embrace it for what it truly is then?
  

  Who do you think appears to be more under WTS control, someone honest enough to state their view publicly, or someone who pretends to still be JW who does not believe any of it?

  I am not sure if you mean this the way I am taking it, but that sounds like a false dichotomy: Either you DA or you are pretending to be a jw.
  

  Because it is totally possible to "state a view publicly" without DAing, those who choose to DA must have a different purpose. Whatever that is, it's their own choice to make and affects me in no way whatsoever.
  

  DAing was your chosen path. Surely you can respect that others can make their own choices too.
  
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  snare&racket

  You can do all those things without a DA letter. Also sending a DA letter makes their rules and silly games real, they are not. It's like writing to Santa to hell him you no longer believe in him.
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  Blackfalcon98

  CONGRATS ON MAKING IT OFFICIAL, DA will be a clean cut for you. There is pretty much very little worries about having to see elders ever again. However, fading has advantages for others in your contact. Either way, enjoy your freedom....and thanks for sharing the great news.

  BF98
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  done4good

  Rebel8-

  I am not sure if you mean this the way I am taking it, but that sounds like a false dichotomy: Either you DA or you are pretending to be a jw.
  

  Because it is totally possible to "state a view publicly" without DAing, those who choose to DA must have a different purpose. Whatever that is, it's their own choice to make and affects me in no way whatsoever.

  Again, I agree completely. No false dichotomy here. My point is that some folks here are very quick to assume that this is playing by the org's rules, and these are often the same very ones who pretend to be JWs, (not you), by what they like to refer as "fading". Fading has an end game, (or it should). That end game should be to live a life free of control by the WTS. If someone chooses to either DA or not, it does not matter, but what does matter is living your own life. A person is not actually fading if they go along with the JW lifestyle while in front of JWs, (family or not), with no endgame to that charade. "Fading" is a bridge, not a destination.

  Arguing whether DA is JW ritual or not really is yet a different discussion. I think a good argument could be made for either, (and maybe it simply does depend on the person), but I know in my case, it had nothing to do with wanting to "play by the rules" one last time for old times' sake. It had everything to do with communicating a message to folks I thought deserving enough to know where I stood.

  d4g