I wonder if perhaps the reference of male and female might be to the positive and negative energies rather than the sexual connotation you're putting on his writing. I don't know, but this may be the case.
Serpent Seed Doctrine and the Kennites
by journey-on 20 Replies latest watchtower bible
-
-
nvrgnbk
I wonder if perhaps the reference of male and female might be to the positive and negative energies rather than the sexual connotation you're putting on his writing. I don't know, but this may be the case.
Nah.
I'm gonna go with eclipse and call it pure unmitigated sh*t.
-
eclipse
I wonder if perhaps the reference of male and female might be to the positive and negative energies rather than the sexual connotation you're putting on his writing. I don't know, but this may be the case.
Good question, journey-on! I actually wasn't even thinking about male / female, it was the ''marital arrangement'' comment that made me go, wtf?? I was thinking, if there are marriage arrangements between angels, and since this JC person is intent on humanizing the looks of god and angels, why not go all the way and ask him if they have sex too? (since logically marriage and sex go hand in hand, do they not?) If he is going to come on a DB, and make ''unique'' comments, he better be prepared to answer any questions about them. I was sincere about being curious to know if he would expound on this ''angel marital arrangement'' that I have NEVER heard of.
-
DeusMauzzim
This is very interesting! Rings a bell with my own research on gnosticism. I'm pretty sure there was such a belief in the first centuries (this ties in with Leoneia's observations)
I'll let you know if I find something!
[ Deus powering up his vast gnostic scripture archives ]
- Deus Mauzzim
-
DeusMauzzim
Ok just brushed up on the subject!
In most gnostic sects, Jehovah really is Yaldabaoth, the evil and ignorant demiurge who controls this world. He is ignorant of his own creation by Sophia, and therefore boasts all the time that 'besides me there is no other' etc. So, remember Jehovah is the bad guy here (I kinda like gnosticism because of that :). Naturally, the Serpent in the Genesis account
really is the hero of the story, because he brings knowledge (gnosis) to Eve, and then to Adam: knowledge that they are slaves to Yaldabaoth in his matrix paradise, and knowledge of the
Father of Lights in the realm above, the real god who gave them their divine spark and to whom they must return.Of course, Yaldabaoth is pissed off by this subvertive action of the serpent and rapes Eve (he would try again later with Norea, Noah's wife). From this, Eloim and Yave are born, known to us as Cain and Abel.
Adam and Eve later have a son called Seth. He receives the gnostic secrets from Adam and becomes the father of all gnostics (i.e all the people who are aware of Yaldabaoth's matrix world and who cultivate their divine spark).This is a somewhat upside-down version of the Serpent Seed: Yaldabaoth tries to destroy the Sethians throughout history.
NB: Keep in mind that there is no such thing as one gnosticism. There were a great many groups with conflicting views (most saw Jehovah as bad, though). The Ophites (or Naasenes)worshipped the snake as hero, the Sethians called themselves after Seth per above. On the other hand the Cainites didn't see Cain evil offspring but as a hero, like the serpent. Don't try to find any consistency here!
Hope this helps with your journey!
See the links for references to the gnostic texts where you can find these things.
Deus Mauzzim
Links:
-
Leolaia
Here are some relevant quotes:
"The mother of the seven sons also addressed these righteous sayings to her children: 'I was a chaste maiden and did not leave my father's house; but I kept guard over the rib built into woman's body [i.e. Eve]. No seducer of the desert nor deceiver in the field [i.e. Satan] corrupted me, nor did the seducing and beguiling serpent defile my maidenly purity. Through all the days of my prime I stayed with my husband ... He read to you of Abel, slain by Cain, of Isaac offered as a burnt offering, and of Joseph in prison" (4 Maccabees 18:6-11).
"By this it may be seen who are the children of God and who are the children of the Devil; whoever does not do right is not of God, nor he who does not love his brother. For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning [i.e. the beginning of the Torah], that we should love one another and not be like Cain, who was of the Evil One and murdered his brother" (1 John 3:10-12).
"What of the fact that she endured not to have been met alone; but in the presence of Adam, not yet her husband, not yet bound to lend her his ears, she is impatient of keeping silence, and makes him the transmitter of that which she had imbibed from the Evil One? .... For straightway that impatience conceived of the devil’s seed, produced, in the fecundity of malice, anger as her son; and when brought forth, trained him in her own arts. For that very thing which had immersed Adam and Eve in death, taught their son, too, to begin with murder. It would be idle for me to ascribe this to impatience, if Cain, that first homicide and first fratricide, had borne with equanimity and not impatiently the refusal by the Lord of his own oblations -- if he is not wroth with his own brother -- if, finally, he took away no one’s life" (Tertullian, De Patientia, 5.15).
"First adultery came into being, afterward murder. And he [Cain] was begotten in adultery, for he was the child of the serpent. So he became a murderer, just like his father, and he killed his brother" (Gospel of Philip 6:5-10).
"And Adam knew about his wife Eve that she had conceived by Sammael the angel of the Lord, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. He resembled the upper ones and not the lower ones, and she said, 'I have acquired a man, indeed, an angel of the Lord' " (Targum Pseudo-Jonathan Genesis 4:1).
"The serpent came into her and she became pregnant with Cain, as it says, 'And the man knew his wife Eve.' What did he know? That she was already pregnant" (Pirqei de Rabbi Eliezer, 21).
-
journey-on
Thank you all for your replies. I'm going to digest all of this and see if any of it fits into any of my belief structures I'm attempting to build. I think some of these old myths, stories, and legends have underlying spiritual truths, and when the metaphorical application is peeled away, a deeper understanding remains from which one can find pieces to the puzzle.
-
DeusMauzzim
I think some of these old myths, stories, and legends have underlying spiritual truths, and when the metaphorical application is peeled away, a deeper understanding remains from which one can find pieces to the puzzle.
Exactly! It's not a question of literally believing these stories, but of (ancient) symbols resonating within your own psyche.
You said you are on a journey - I totally agree with that. It is a journey of the mind... I envision it as a vast labyrinth full of symbols and inscriptions on the walls. As I travel through the labyrinth by reading, researching, thinking... some of these inscriptions and symbols light up, resonate within me.. and I know I have found something that helps me along.
Who knows where the journey will end?
Respectfully,
Deus Mauzzim
-
changeling
Wow! Yes I am an atheist, as in anti-theist! I don't believe any of this stuff!. I'm free, I'm free!
changeling
-
journey-on
You said you are on a journey - I totally agree with that. It is a journey of the mind... I envision it as a vast labyrinth full of symbols and inscriptions on the walls. As I travel through the labyrinth by reading, researching, thinking... some of these inscriptions and symbols light up, resonate within me.. and I know I have found something that helps me along.
This is the way I feel, too, DeusMauzzim. If the vibration resonates within me, I know it's meant for my spiritual evolution and will include it till I either assimilate it, accommodate it, or no longer need it and toss it out. I'm free to choose what works for me.