"You have received nothing but love from us..."

by DeusMauzzim 19 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  BFD

  I would ask

  Do you mind if I talk about the pedophiles in the catholic church, and why?

  BFD
• 

  outnfree

  "I love you, too, Mom and Dad, but I am VERY concerned for your eternal welfare, because I am certain that you have been duped. I wish you would make sure of the things I am trying to share with you, so that you can make an INFORMED decision about your faith."
  
  (Tried my best to make it sound reassuringly familiar while espousing toying with apostasy -- in their eyes, of course.)
• 

  AuldSoul

  Deus Mauzzim,

  I received nothing like love from the organization, and I was raised in "the Truth". I loved it, but it did not love me.

  1 Corinthians 13:4-7 — Love is long-suffering and kind. Love is not jealous, it does not brag, does not get puffed up, does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked. It does not keep account of the injury. It does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

  Let's take a look at the highlighted ones:

  long-suffering: For one full year (and a couple of months) I strove to get Scriptural answers to my questions. While it could be argued that they were being long-suffering with me during that period of time, this could only be claimed if they first admit that there is no need for a Christian religion to have clear (non-interpretive) Scriptural support for its doctrine.

  kind: Insight On the Scriptures says, [Kindness is] "the quality or state of taking an active interest in the welfare of others; friendly and helpful acts or favors." I had dozens of meetings with the elders and even a couple with the CO. I asked for audiences with the Service Desk or Governing Body members and was told I could not have them. I asked where I could get Scriptural answers to my doctrinal/policy questions if the elders and CO couldn't give them and I couldn't seek answers from the source of the doctrines/policy without accusation of apostasy. Did the organization have an active interest in my welfare, or its own welfare?

  does not brag, does not get puffed up: Jehovah's servants are "the happiest group of people on earth." "Jehovah’s Witnesses alone are declaring the good news that the Kingdom has been functioning in the heavens since 1914 with Jesus Christ as King." (Technically true, but misleading since it hasn't been ... still, it's bragging) "During the 20th century, [Jehovah's people] saw the fulfillment of Isaiah’s words: 'The little one himself will become a thousand, and the small one a mighty nation. I myself, Jehovah, shall speed it up in its own time.'" "Jehovah’s motherlike organization diligently fulfills its responsibility to prepare delightful spiritual meals served through its publications and at the meetings of the more than 85,000 Christian congregations worldwide." The organization is characterized by bragging about itself, and puffing itself up by comparing itself favorably to other less desirable "so-called Christian" religions. This has been the case ever since C.T. Russell.

  does not behave indecently: In Insight On the Scriptures, "shammatta" is called a "very powerful weapon" that was used by the Sanhedrin to control the behavior of Jews through threat. It was because of fear of shammatta that many heard but did not respond to Jesus. It was unquestionably indecent of the Sanhedrin to attempt to control people's spiritual decisions through threats of retaliation. Yet, this is exactly what was attempted in my case—leading directly and swiftly to my disassociating myself.

  does not look for its own interests: "If the point still cannot be understood, it may be best to let the matter rest. Perhaps more information on the subject will be published, and then our understanding will be broadened. It would be wrong, however, to try to convince others in the congregation to accept our own divergent opinion. This would be sowing discord, not working to preserve unity." They admit that the truth does not matter as much as does preserving unity. And since they admit that some may not agree with what is being taught, they admit that they only create the appearance of unity. To what end, if not protecting the interests of the organization above the interests of the sheep? Without any doubt, the organization looks for its own interests. Every elder and ministerial servant knows this. It is not love.

  does not become provoked: Someone speaking TRUE statements about the Cartilla obtained by bribe that was officially permitted the sheep in Mexico and truthfully comparing this Cartilla—which identified the holder as first reservist in the armed forces of Mexico, should the need arise, and which lyingly stated that the bearer had completed military service and training they had NOT completed—comparing this Cartilla with the political party card in Malawi, a nation with only ONE political party at the time, is enough to get someone disfellowshipped if they don't shut up. My brother-in-law, the Service Overseer, even asked me why I couldn't just shut up about these things. The organization is easily provoked. Their response is swift and purely in self-interest. They bludgeon offenders with shammatta, a "very powerful weapon" in the Jehovah's Witness community.

  does not keep account of the injury: Any elder can quickly dispel anyone's fanciful notion that the organization does not keep account of the injury, but I doubt any JW lurker believes that the organization doesn't keep account of the injury.

  rejoices with the truth: Actually, the organization strives desperately to minimize the organizational impact of "the truth." The truth is the natural enemy of most organizations, and Jehovah's Witnesses are no exception. For instance, the truth is there is not even a remote possibility that Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC. Tens of thousands of ancient documents remove all possibility of this date being accurate. But the organization does not rejoice in this truth, rather, the organization cringes in fear that this truth will somehow, someday escape the boring and tedious world of scholarship and deposit itself in the public eye in a way that JWs cannot avoid seeing it. They will readily use shammatta against anyone who tries to bring this truth to light.

  bears all things ... endures all things: Well, we ALL know this doesn't apply to the organization. The list of things the organization refuses to bear or endure is very long, and includes many, many things not condemned by the Bible.

  Deus, that would be my response. Love is characterized by something very different than this organization has ever shown me. I hope that helps.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
• 

  Scully

  This is how abusive spouses attempt to incite guilt into their victims. They'll say how you took vows, that it's "until death do you part" etc.

  It's the same with the WTS. "You made a promise when you got baptized to serve Jehovah forever. You're the one breaking that promise, not us."

  There are ways to get out of a "contract" though. One that I think applies to the WTS is fraud. They have not kept their promises, the promises keep changing, and the so-called "love" they claim to provide is conditional in the extreme. You did not sign up to be mentally and emotionally and spiritually abused. That is a deal breaker.

  And just like a wife whose abusive husband tries to lay a guilt trip on her for wanting a divorce, we can say "You broke the vows first. I'm outta here."
• 

  DeusMauzzim

  Thanks all, I needed that! Very much. Period.

  Deus Mauzzim
• 

  drew sagan

  Do you mind if I talk about the pedophiles in the catholic church, and why?

  Excellent point!
  
  They raised you in an environment where others people where slandered 5 times a week. They are selective in their judgments.
• 

  JWdaughter

  Not to be obnoxious, but what is the promise that one makes as a JW? Is it part of the baptism vow, "I promise to love and faithfully serve, not unlike a mindless beast, the Faithful and discreet slave, and to uphold whatever crap they spew into the pages of the WT and expect me to disseminate?".

  I don't know-could you ask them whether it was Jehovah or the organization that you were baptised into? Unless you went wild with sex drugs and rock and roll, how is questioning MEN- breaking any promise to God?
• 

  greendawn

  I would also say that the promise to the WTS (not to God as they like to say) has no validity and never did because the org itself has certain duties and promises to fulfill towards its members but it fails to do so. Let alone that it is a commercial enterprise rather than a religion.
• 

  AuldSoul

  On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
  
  Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization?

  JW Daughter, they consider the answer to these two questions a promise. Notice how very different this preliminary step to baptism is when compared with Acts 2, 8, 10, and 16.
• 

  steve2

  How would I respond to such a statement that oozes emotional blackmail?

  I think I would acknowledge the obvious hurt feelings underlying the statement, but also suggest to the speaker that they need to find a way to express their feelings without resorting to emotional blackmail.