Email to my Dad on the UN / Prison Stories (page 2)

hillary_step

Hello MSIL,

Wise and compassionate words Kent. I just wanted to join Kent and others in offering my support and best wishes to you. My email address is open should you need help.

HS

Nathan Natas

Msil,

May I asked what country you're in?

I've got questions about your time in prison, if I may: How long were you imprisoned for neutrality? Was it the incarceration itself that caused you trouble, or were you treated badly while you served your time?

I was draft age in the late 60's and obtained my conscientious objector's deferrment and then a ministerial deferrment (I was pioneering). I fully expected to have to go to prison - my "elders" led me to believe that only the worst could happen - and was very happy not to have to go.

I will certainly understand if you prefer not to discuss these things.

I wish you well.

bboyneko

In the ideal christian world all conflicts would be resolved by everyone sitting on their asses and pratying for god to do something about it.

But the fact is god does NOT intervene in ANYTHING..we are left on our own to resolve issues. If a country invades ours, or an allies, do we just remain pascifist, thou shalt not kill etc etc? Military service and the military in general should be considered a good thing. It sure is easy for people like the jehovahs witnesses to refuse military service and go to jail when thousands of otheres are out fighting to protect the country they are improsened in, preventing enemy troops from bombing friends and relatives.

Bottom line: JW suck..i cant beleive theyve sent so many to their graves and to prisons and destroyed so many families and still operate without any problems under the law (except maybe in france and russia)

mommy

Msil,
I applaud you for putting part of yourself out here for us. This thread reminds me of why we all gather here. There are precious few who realize what the org does to families and lives. And few are willing to step inside and find out. We need each other. I often think about what will happen if my mom ever leaves the org. I understand those feelings you are having about your parents leaving as well. I bet you feel really bad for showing them, and letting them get hurt as well. Though a part of you knows that it is in their best interest. Just rememeber your voice will always be heard here

Kent,
You are such a loveable fellow
wendy

Blind faith can justify anything.~Richard Dawkins

msil

To all of you,

Thanks so much for the support and encouragement. There are many things (upheavals) going on in my life right now some bad, some awful and some experiences I have had over the past week have been the happiest days of my life too. Perhaps its this blend which led me to post this here.

In any event, there are questions I cannot answer - for the sake of my family. Questions like: country and how long (I will tell you it was for more than 3 years - thats all. The society can quite quickly deduce things from such information if I give it out specifically....I have met other brothers from other countries....they say I was in prison for x years....and many times I know by x where they were imprisoned).

We spent many nights cold and hungry and some times the military would give us bad food - which made us ill...(I carried more than one brother unconcious to the hospital....as I was myself on occasion).

We stood up to the military, we did hard time (manual labor digging trenches by hand, no luxuries, no TVs, radios, etc -just your clothes - 2 overalls) a bunch of boys (too young to really be called men) for the principles such as "My kingdom is NO PART of this world". We took our licks for it. We did so proudly and we each thought "Jehovah's Heart is rejoicing as we make our reply to the one who is taunting him". Even now my mother is able to come to terms with my inactivity as a JW by saying "it's OK. Jehovah will not forget about it." She thinks somehow I earned heaven-credit or something.... I love the angel who made me so happy.

While I am not sure if I have it in me to kill people.....we were not allowed (by the society) to do alternate service at the time. This was subsequently amended when "new light" came out. I have discussed this before now with elders......I cannot accept the "new light" without some form of apology. Why can't they just say "the organization was wrong"? A bunch of pathetic rationalizing went on and I just looked at them and said nothing. Some of them even told me privately they understood my viewpoint on the matter.

Now the UN thing....the hypocrisy!!! I am disgusted. If they want to DF me for it they can - then I will see them in court and I will take it to the public press all over. I am unstable right now, I am close the point where I am ready to lose everything....but then so will they.

There are more than one of me here.

msil

I was 16 when I went to prison.

My second night there I was with a brother....and another one came and said they wanted to show me something. Being new and curious...I followed into the cell block. We went into a type of hallway....it was badly lit.

As I got to the middle of the room people stepped out from the shadows...pushed a chair towards me and told me to be seated. There mus hve been 20 of them. I recognized some of them (all the "brothers" were housed together).

As I sat down one of them came to wards me and said to me:

"You are on trial. Sit up." Having being sentenced the day before and already in the prison I knew something was going to happen. The person then said to me: "you are charged with being green".

"Green?" I asked.

"Yes, Green!!" he stormed and proceeded to kick out the chair from under me sending me sprawling into the slate floor. I recognized him then. He was one of the brothers "taking the lead". He was 21, I was 16.

"What are you doing" I asked "what's going on?"

He said "you are found GUILTY as charged...you are Green." As he said that someone from behind me threw a blanket over my head and others pulled it down and held it fast. The blanket was wet.

I do not know how many times I was hit that night. I was dragged over to the showers and left there....bleeding from my right eye, nose and my mouth.

I do not reacall much more....of what happened that night.

The next morning I was in line for food....I received my food and walked over to get a slice of bread (it was always in a separate basket). The "judge" was on the other side of the basket. He said to me: "....welcome to XXXXXXX congregation!".

I thanked him and went to eat with the brothers. I was never able to do that to the other brothers who came in after me.

bluesapphire

MSIL: I can see why this UN issue hit you so hard. I don't blame you for being angry. I am angry too and I didn't go through what you went through. If your dad is walking around saying, "It can't be true, it can't be true." It is not such a bad thing.

He read the information. It will take time for it to sink in. He will pay closer attention. The way the WTS responds to this issue may be the thing that makes him want to leave. Just be patient.

On the other hand, my sister would not even sit with me or read anything from me. So she will never have the information in her head to make her think. At least your dad knows. She doesn't have a clue.

msil

Blue.....he does not know the stories about "the inside". I did not want my parents to worry about me.

Thanks for the response. I really hope that your sister will see that this is much larger than anyone gives credit for.

Sincerely,
MSIL

zev

msil...

you brought tears to my eyes reading this...

please remember...that although many in the org are good people, there are those who arnt. and thats the reason we all fight for what we KNOW is right, and true.

you know many of the issues we discuss here.
pedophiles and the likes of them.

wolfs in sheeps skin.

thans for sharing such painfull, touching memories with us.

my thoughts, my prayers, are with you.

-Zev
-August 8th, 2001 - The day the lambs ROARED

msil

Last one for today....

A Taste of Freedom.

Ever had your freedom taken away from you? There is no worse feeling in life. Dealing with death is easier for me than that feeling.

Our cells were locked sometimes. It made no difference. Around the prison was a 20 foot metal wall....on top of that were a few miles of razor wire. Our bathrooms were in the middle of a courtyard.

About a week into my sentence, a brother named John approached me. He was a very kind person. He gave me my first taste of freedom.

It was about 7pm and it was getting dark outside. John went to the bathroom and climed up the bars on the outside of the building and pulled himself up on the roof and then lay down. I followed and ducked for cover on the top of the roof as well.

"look there", John said, and pointed to the freeway on the other side of the prison wall.

LIGHTS....Red tail lights and white headlights in rows - Traffic!!!

As we lay there I was free. I was in the traffic. I was everyone of those drivers going home at the end of the day to be with my family! It was glorious!! Every light was a light oh hope to me. I knew that one day I would be able to go home to my family too.

Email to my Dad on the UN / Prison Stories

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