Why atheism?

by Skimmer 28 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  COMF

  Rex, talk about something you know, please (assuming there is such a thing). You're just babbling nonsense on this topic.

  COMF
• 

  Contagion

  I am an Atheist because my beliefs exclude any personal creator. And any impersonal "god" is just something else you decided to call god, leaving the word semantically empty. If you call "Nature" "god", well whatever i'll keep calling it Nature. There are alternatives to believing in a creator that are mutually exclusive with it. Making you an Atheist while not denying anything.And more people are born into Atheism every day.
• 

  Abaddon

  skimmer;

  First, let me thank all of you for your thoughtful responses.

  Why, that's a pleasure. You can pay us all the compliment of ADDRESSING THE ISSUES now.

  Second, for any who might have taken umbrage at my comments as being patronizing, you are mistaken as to my intent. There is apparently some misinterpretation of my use of the word "choice"; maybe "decision" would have been better. But in this context I think it is a distinction without a difference.

  Read my post. I make the point that your whole question is actually meaningless. That continues to be true even if you use "decision" instead of "choice". From one semantical viewpoint your question makes it sound like the process of becoming an atheist is akin to choosing from a box of chocolates. I did think, as my post shows, that you actually meant something more considered.

  So, what's your point? You decided to be an RC. Most people do not 'decide' to be any religion, they are what their parents were, by inertia. How does passive selection of belief or active selection of belief in any way compare unfavourably with active selection of disbelief?

  Third, as for diatribes against theism or Christianity, some of what was posted is pretty good -- perhaps almost as good as what I've once said myself. Ones by the likes of Voltaire, Nietzsche, and Ayn Rand are even better. Are they convincing? That is for each to decide.

  Phoey. Stop ringing doorbells and running away. Engage in debates you start. Saying "Oooo, nice comments, thank you" is just crap.

  Fido, Lassie, Hobo, errr... Rex!

  My own two cents to your quesion:

  And I thought you were intellectually bankrupt! ARe those your last two cents then?

  As a JW, one is taught all of the negatives about Christianity, the mysteries are scoffed at with rationalistic thought that completely ignores scriptural interpretation.

  That's one unsupported assumption of faith (the existence of mysteries, the belief in the ineffable).

  Along with that, the Society (as do Islam and many other false religions) denies the deity of Christ.

  That's two unsupported assumptions (divinity of Christ).

  JWs deny the immortal soul and the separation from God for those who refuse the atonement offered by Christ's sacrifice.

  That's four unsupported assumptions.

  They slander real Christianity and create a mindset hostile to anyone but them, i.e., you've heard 'dubs say, "If the WTS is wrong, then all are wrong" or, "I'll never join any other religion".
  The last part is a leftover fear that just "maybe the Society is right". That's why we see temporary increases in meeting attendance when a crisis occurs.
  Once people discover that JW rationalism cannot explain every scripture to satisfy skeptics, they easily lose faith in the Lord God Almighty. It's really a brilliant and effective way for Slanderer to trap more people in his web of deceit.
  They never receive the Holy Spirit. They worship a sad characature of God, one that is not sovereign (in ultimate control) and is one dimensional (the Father only). They are false teachers who are controlled by His Nibs.
  The best lies are the ones with a grain of truth.
  Rex

  Zzzzz... zzzzz... zzzzz... zzzzz... hwa? huh? uh, oh yeah...

  Rex, please try to avoid your cyberterrorism of death by boredom.

  Your peachy little faith suffused diatribes are all very well, but to many people here they are considerably less interesting than a five-year-old's debates on Santa Claus. Convince us of the actuality of what you believe and the doctrinal twaddle might mean something. Otherwise, your just masturbating over a keyboard for your own amusement.

  Love and sloppy kisses...!

  Keep on rocking in the free world...
• 

  Sirona

  Hi, I havent had time to read all these comments yet, but I would like to say I agree wholeheartedly with this comment by RunningMan:

  Christians apparently need to categorize athiests and explain their heresy through the
  use of character flaws, past injury, or indoctrination.

  Personally, I am not atheist, neither am I christian. I dont believe in the God of the bible.
  Sirona
• 

  patio34

  Hi Skimmer,

  Hope this hasn't been covered all ready. In your opening post, you mentioned that very few are raised as atheists or have atheism put upon them as children.

  Actually, all people are born atheists. It's only when a parent teaches religion to the child, that they become theists.

  I agree with JanH's statement that very few people are deep down believers. I was a very active JW for 28 years, but deep down, I wondered at how people could REALLY believe in what we were saying. Most of the time I just went along with it, hoping the belief would get stronger. I just believed I was "weak" in faith.

  But after reading books other than the WTS, by scientists and historians, I could see that atheism is a much more likely 'truth.'

  Pat
• 

  D wiltshire

  I personally beleive in God's Existance 99% and maybe 1% doubt.
  I realize I don't have all the facts and answers.
  The reasons here expressed by those who choose Atheism seem to be well thought out, not spur of the moment conclusions. So I don't fault any of you and feel you have thought long and HARD about this.

  My own feeling about justice and God's dealing with his creatures is:

  If God lives outside TIME(since he is said to have created it), then his actions as we who live inside TIME see them would be very puzzeling. As my signature profile suggests we live only a short time and veiw personally only a little segment of TIME which as I see it TIME has no point that we can say this is where time began, or this is the point in the future time will end.

  Maybe TIME had no begining and was always here this makes more sense to me. Maybe TIME has been around forever and will bearound forever in the future, to me this seem more logical.(I could be wrong).
  Can time be slowed down or altered by gravity? Learned men seem to think so.
  For that matter can anyone tell us all the mechanics of time.

  I can not judge cleary and rightly a person who lives outside time for I know nothing about such.
  So I feel more comfortable in my heart to beleive in him and give him any benifit of any doubt I may have about his justice.
  Is that what FAITH is? I mean trusting God even though all the evidence is not in and perhaps may never be.
  To me FAITH is a reasonable ASSUMPTION, without all the evidence.
  I'm not talking about Faith in man made religious organizations they turn me off.

  If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
• 

  JanH

  D w,

  I responded to this message from you here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=14200&page=4&site=3

  - Jan
  --
  "Doctor how can you diagnose someone with Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and then act like I had some choice about barging in here right now?" -- As Good As It Gets
• 

  peacepipe

  JanH,

  As usual, I really enjoy reading your thoughts.

  It is my clear impression that many believers just think they believe; to them theism is a membership in a social group that shares a system of beliefs, and they don't give it much thought before they experience a crisis and realize they don't believe, deep down inside, that there is a God that will take them to heaven or whenever when they die.

  Now that is going in my journal! . . . . .wrote a bunch of stuff. . . . deleted it all. . . .yada yada yada. . . .

  Anyhow you hit the nail on the head in my book. Thanks

  PeacePipe

  Lift me up, I've had enough. . .Tom Petty
• 

  garybuss

  Hi All,

  I wanted to be a believing theist and a Jehovah’s Witness. I just lost my ability to deny reality and suspend disbelief. A rational approach to life required rational thinking and much of the information provided to me to accept as fact by the Jehovah’s Witnesses was dogmatic by nature and did not have the ability to withstand objective scrutiny. Dido theism.

  I probably am agnostic on many subjects. I am skeptical of all claims relative to ghosts, gods, goblins and things super-(un)- human. I wait to see the proof of intervention by gods in the affairs of humans.

  I have never seen one human problem or need solved or filled by any other than a human way. Give me a hungry mystic and a hungry humanist and I believe I can tell you who will get fed first every time.