We Should Give Newbies the Benefit of the Doubt (page 4)

OnTheWayOut

I left my comment up here a full minute, but don't want the heat from MR. Flipper so
I took it away.

nvrgnbk

I left my comment up here a full minute, but don't want the heat from MR. Flipper so
I took it away.

I wish I would have seen it.

dinah

V-8 Slap to the forehead. I get it!!!

When someone does a hit and run, floods the board with posts, and gives vague answers that could be construed as true.

Thank you guys for sticking with me. When I first joined I poured my heart out and was welcomed warmly. Of course I had been there done that, knew some of the lingo.

flipper

Thanks for all your responses. First of all, I consider all of you friends here. I will respond to your replies.

GREGOR- I certainly was not trying to be your daddy or momma.If I offended you in some way, I am sorry. I feel I have put forth my views of things here in a respectful tone and my views have been put forth as observations. Most of the posters seem to agree with my views. I respect that you don't , no big deal. It's your right. Cool! I agree some newbie posters are con artists, but as you said, we always want to welcome them like you do too!

In regards to my closing my posts with peace out, it is a genuine wish of peace for you, and everybody else who is reading my post! It is not an affectation or phony, or a facade. I truly wish everybody here peace when I post. I'm real , always have been, always will be ! I am a straightforward guy, what you see is what you get, no B.S. So, Gregor Peace out to you ,Mr. Flipper

LOVER of TRUTH- Thanks for your post. Healing is a process and we can help it with love!

OTWO- I did read the post you put up about challenging my believing the poster inactive's story. What makes you assume I would give you heat about you questioning that? It is a fair enough question that you asked me, so give me the opportunity to answer it. I have mentioned in my answer to NVR that I agree this woman's story was one of the most bizarre stories I have ever heard too since I've been on this board . But, that being said, I personally have gone through more bizarre things than she went through, having been raised in the organization 44 years and out, the last 4. You are certainly welcome to your opinion, I respect that , but from my experiences personally, and what I've seen of others experiences who I personally know, it was believable. I used to see certain congregation elders almost form their own club, independent of the societies direction, and have their own set of rules how they dealt with the rank and file publishers . It was not pretty. And not in harmony with what they considered the " faithful and discreet slave's " way of operating. So, we have each had our experiences. Some of us have experienced totally off the wall things as opposed to what others have. Does that mean we doubt ? Perhaps . But for those of us who have been dealt a severe blow by this cult, it is very real my friend. I respect you, and like you as a person OTWO. I remain your fellow poster and friend, Peace out, Mr. Flipper

flipper

DINAH- We will always stick wqith you. We know you are real! Peace out, Mr. Flipper

WTWizard

I think that is a good idea to give newbies the benefit of the doubt. The Trevor situation is one poster. We have more than 25,000 posters here. This means one scam per 25,000 posters--or about 0.004%. Do we allow 0.004% of the board rule us?

Remember, everyone's experiences in that "unified" Watchtower Society is different. Some are getting harassed by the hounders, while others are being shunned for nothing. There are many that are being ignored for a time, and then 10 years later they start in. Some have family that is bent on ratting them out. Some have other congregation members making up stories to get them in trouble for not doing things as they think they should be done. There are a few families that are bent on taking in one or more individuals as their own property; others, they are left on their own. Some are pushed into pioneering and have "privileges" pushed into their faces, while others want "privileges" and are denied repeatedly.

There is, however, a common denominator. Everyone who has ever been involved in the Watchtower Society has had someone trying to control their lives. All these methods, as contradictory as they seem, fit this. Recapturing someone is one method of doing this. And so is cutting someone off. Hounding people to pick up "privileges" is a means of controling someone, since that is going to take away their free time. And, so is denying "privileges" since the person is going to try ever harder to "earn" them. It is all about control.

Then there are the incidental experiences. Children have had different forms of persecution in school for not saluting the flag, playing with worldly classmates, being too tired because of boasting sessions that ran past 10:00 on school nights, no parties or class trips, and running into classmates in field circus. Not everyone has had all of them, but most everyone has had one or more of them. Not all families are super strict--meaning that some children are allowed fun on vacations, have special days of recreation set aside, have never been kept out in field circus so long that they peed their pants, or had their music library pruned to 225 songs. But, the ones whose parents followed the Tower the closest have had most or all these experiences.

Adults, too, run into different problems. This too depends on how "strong" the congregation is. The strongest ones are strictest. Some have individual families (usually headed by hounders) that will prune their music or video libraries and enforce different rules or sabotage their finding mates or decent jobs behind their backs while not bothering others. Some have had more trouble in field circus. Those with family members (or someone acting like family members) that are goading them to do ever more will suffer more than those who are left to fade in peace.

When we see a new story, we are best to have the attitude that your experiences will vary. Just because one person has been physically carried into a Kingdumb Hell or been rejected by the whole congregation despite not having been reproved does not mean this is the norm. Nor does it mean that it will happen to everyone in the organization. We know that there are cases where someone has been disfellowshipped for reporting child abuse to the outside authorities, but not everyone has. Usually, it means that the hounders are acting toward one person in a unique way or that the parents are abusing their children in some novel way (hey, it happens in this organization). We do not need to reply to pleas to send in money or other items that could be a scam. But, we should remember that this organization that claims and showcases unity is anything but unified.

DublDipd

If this is not too off topic, could someone in 50 words or less describe this "trevor-gate" thing to me. Was it some kind of scam? Just curious...

From what I gather, someone came on here with a pretty good sob story and took some of the kinder folks on here for a ride.

Anyway, just wondering.

HAL9000

After a few years of watching the comings & goings it's really apparent that different people have different issues with the Watchtower Organisation and that the many needs of those coming here should be respected.

While many members are former / fading JW's, there are also the "ubm's" such as myself who have a significant other in the clutches of this most repungant and deceptive organisation. I have, over the past 18 months or so asked for help and got it when I needed it, particularly in trying to understand the babble that the WTS spews forth. I would be significantly poorer in my continuing attempts to understand what is being drilled into my wife & how I can mitigate the damage. If others were deprived of this advice, JWD would be a poorer place.

A consequence of my non-JW background is that my understanding of JW practices & attitudes is poor to the point of non-existence & I have felt on occasions that my bonafides are suspected due to the naievity of my comments or questions. I also see others who have significant issues in their lives and are prepared to lay all out on the board - after the Trevor debacle I can understand why there is so much suspicion, but as WTWizard pointed out, the Trevor/Lindas deception was one member of very many.

h9k

flipper

WT WIZARD- Thanks for your reply! I agree that everyone has their own stories that are unique and we benefit everybody involved by respecting their stories. Whether the stories are odd or not, just because the stories are different from our experience does not mean it didn't happen. So thanks for your answers, we really should give newbies the benefit of the doubt, I agree. Trevor was a small percentage of the board. I feel most posters have good motives. Peace out ! Good post Wizard !

I will reply to the other poster about "trevor" in a pm

Finally-Free

I'm all for giving a newbie the benefit of the doubt as long as they're civil to others.

I looked back at the thread unactive? started. I didn't read the whole thread, but the experience didn't surprise me. I had my own share of crazy experiences with the JWs, some quite similar to the ones described there. When I was a JW it sometimes seemed like the elders were doing everything they could to drive me and my ex out. I've seen it happen to others too. I was once told by an elder, who opposed this decision, that the elder body had decided to write an extremely negative letter about me if I should ever decide to move elsewhere in the future. He said he couldn't tell me what the subject matter of the letter would be. When I moved about 6 months later it was confirmed that such a letter was sent, and the new PO was enraged at my former elder body. I still was never told what this letter contained, but I have my suspicions. When I eventually did leave the cult, I was stalked. I was under surveillance. There was a car chase. There was a campaign to ruin my reputation among the "worldly" people in the neighbourhood I grew up in, and it was still going on 2 years after I moved away.

I don't think anything could surprise me about that cult, so I'd rather give a newbie the benefit of the doubt, even if their story sounds strange.

W

We Should Give Newbies the Benefit of the Doubt

Share this