I need a simplified explanation...

XOCO

today i had a sister do a bible study with me and i asked her if Jesus really died on a torture stake instead of a cross and i showed her john 20:25 emphasizing Hands with an s and nails with an s. what the sister had told me was "yes one nail though his hands and one nail though his feet" ok so now back to the emphasis of the s if that were the case why make hand and nail plural be written in the bible then?

Superfine Apostate

if i remember correctly... in the "bible stories" book they have an image of jesus nailed to a stake with two nails through his crossed hands. but i'm not sure. you can make just about anything of the bible anyway.

AlmostAtheist

I don't think you can get too far with this one. There are imaginable scenarios in which a person could be secured to a stake using four nails.

My opinion only, but I don't think this one is worth bothering with. Yeah, the stake idea is almost surely wrong. But since you can't prove it definitively, and you CAN prove so many other things, why bother with this one?

Dave

AK - Jeff

Remember with whom you are dealing here. This is the same bunch that allowed spirit-medium Greber's Bible translation to be 'proof' of the use of the definite article inserted in John 1:1 to disprove the Trinity. Ignoring an honest question about singular or plural nouns is no problem for them. They couldn't see a forest since they are up against the trees.

If the GB told them that the moon was made of green cheese and that they were about to board a spaceship to go get some, they would begin lining up for the privilege to go, never questioning the premise.

Jeff

OnTheWayOut

Your understanding is a simplified explanation. The scripture says that he wants to see
the holes in the hands from the nails.

Her explanation is doctrinal gymnastics. It really is pointless to try to get any simpler
than understanding it the way it was written.

My opinion, "What difference does it make?" If Watchtower wants to say that the cross
is from paganism before the death of Christ, then ask if it is possible that a cross was
used. Once she commits, then evidence shows her up. It is possible.

Doug Mason

If the "cross" is from paganism, does this mean that the "stake" is Christian?

Surely, the major issue is the EFFECT of Jesus' death, rather than the shape of the implement.

For the WTS, the effectiveness of Jesus' death and resurrection is limited to its own elite group. Indeed, everything that the WTS draws from the Scriptures is aimed at ensuring its authoritarian position.

Doug

Nathan Natas

I can't locate the post right now, but a few months ago a poster presented an argument that the cross was foreshadowed by the Israelite altar.

I'm an atheist, so this doesn't convince me, but I did think it was an interesting argument that I hadn't heard before.

Perhaps someone with a better memory than I have can point you to it.

logic

I have read thousands of pages of info on this subject. There are so many scenarios, that are possible with the placement of the hands. The one explanation that makes scince to me is that there was a stake, pole, etc. that remained at a certain location, the cross beam would be carried by the poor soul to be killed. The person would be attached to the cross beam and them hoisted up and placed onto the pole by some simple means. If you have ever installed a large post , etc. in a hole , you would not want to do so more that once especially with some one attached to it . But this is still just theory but it is my favorite theory . The thing about it is that the person could still be considered to be hung on a pole, stake as the greek work word indicates.

carla

It would be physically impossible for Christ to last as long as He did on the cross with hands above the head as they portray.

http://www.freeminds.org/doctrine/cross.htm

Don't forget their scholarly dishonesty concerning Lispius too- http://www.pfo.org/jw&cross.htm

medical theory-http://www.iamtheway.com/crucifixion.htm

Google for more medical evidence that it could not have been a stake, there's lots out there. It is the internet, let the reader beware. Research, research and research some more.

greendawn

I also concur that arguing about the cross shape is pointless Christians see the cross, whatever it was, as a symbol of salvation and not as something associated with a pagan deity as the JWs like to claim.

The theme is very Christian, it is the destruction of the overwhelming power of death through the death of the Saviour.

I need a simplified explanation...

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