how to help a loved one

by FlyAway2 12 Replies latest jw friends

  • FlyAway2
    FlyAway2

    Hello all. I come here today to ask for any thoughts on how I can help my girlfriend, an ex-witness. Coming from a background of being raised in the "truth" from day one, and also suffering numerous bouts of abuse from an elder in her congregation as a small child, she seems to have now reached a point where she's simply dead inside.

    I thought (foolishly, perhaps) that I could help her recover, "worldly" as I am, and not having been raised in such a religion, I believed I could help her learn that the outside world is not what she was raised to believe it to be; that there are good people out there, and a loving God as well. Not one based on fear and hate.

    Unfortunately, as we've progressed through our relationship, I'm beginning to see the effects of the brainwashing used by the witness organization take its toll. Although she was kicked out a number of years ago, the mentality has stuck like glue (in my opinion). Some days it seems like she's on her way up the downward spiral, thinking and acting like normal, but when I think she's starting to heal, the next day it's like she's relapsed ten times worse. She now is asking me if we could attend a Sunday meeting just to see what it would be like.

    I've always been fearful that she'd return to the religion, especially when she tries to explain their beliefs to me in an attempt to get me to understand what she came from. It sickens me to hear the drone-like theories and responses coming from her mouth. I feel even worse when I realize that I will never know or understand what she went through. She's reluctant to share, and I feel priviledged that she's shared as much as she has already. But truth be told, I'm getting to my rope's end as well. It's like there's no helping her.

    I read Flipper's post on methods of unlocking the mind control, and I gave it a try a few days ago, but as usual, every question I asked thinking I would stump her or get her to think, she only fired back with responses which did that to ME. "Typical witness" is what my mind was screaming. She refuses to share enough about her past for me to get to know who she was back then. There is no pre-cult identity; only the rebellious post-cult one, which frankly I don't want her to reflect on, as drone-talk is enough to turn my stomach. I don't need to hear more about the drug/sex/alcohol days. You would think things were turning for the positive when I asked where she saw herself in x-amount of years, and she said with me. But the way she talks about our relationship these days, how she just does what people tell her to do, how she's programmed, etc, it's like she's more of a drone in our relationship then she was in the religion. This, of course, saddens me deeply. I do not wish to be a repeat of what hurt her so bad in the first place. I know it's bad because I ask what she wants to do in life, her hopes, her dreams, and she says "cease existing". I don't want to believe that's all that's in her head, because sometimes she can be so alive and give me so much hope for her recovery. Other times, she has me ready to snap and end things for my own sanity, because I don't know if I can deal with this constant up and down for the rest of my life. Then I feel guilty for betraying her. When I get frustrated she says I'm no different from "one of them", that I must be stupid for not understanding. She knows well enough that the organization, its doctrine, and its teachings are bogus, but she says that letting that in to her brain raises up this reluctancy for her to accept it. It's denial, she says. Her mind tells her that all the anti-JW things are BS, even though she knows it's not.

    I apologize for the long-winded post. I'm just lost and confused. I've managed to link up with a few others who are in very similar situations, but I'm still left with the same dilemma, and I'm clueless how to approach it as neither any contacts nor myself have any first-hand experience in this religion or anything like it. So I thought to seek help right from the source. I thank you for your time, and look forward to any advice or information you can share.

  • momzcrazy
    momzcrazy

    Welcome to JWD. I would lovingly suggest she seek therapy to help deal with her issues. Besides the JW influence, she also has abuse issues. Make sure she knows you love her and will stick by her (if you plan to). Research a bit on the religion. I know some here will add their reading and research recommendations. This is a great place to start. As much as you can find out about them, the more you are able to understand what she is going thru. But there are many here dealing with the same issues.

    Good luck.

    momzcrazy

  • R.Crusoe
    R.Crusoe

    Welcome to multifacetted circular reasonings!

    We love you if you do as we say but what we say is not in you rhead or your heart so change them both and we will love you! And they do - but you know they don't love the real you and the longer you become the you they want you to be the less you are the you that you are untileven you forget how to be yourself and be loved for it!

    That's just the start! When family also behave that way its like a carousel where everyone is moving after each other but never quite getting to where they're at! And the WTBTS keeps turning at the centre!

    Her only way is out IMHO but she needs someone who understands what it's like to be in who can also pretty well sum things up so it makes sense and gives her brain fodder to hold onto! Many would say order her a copy of Crisis of Conscience. Great start! But the path is longer than that as you well know!

    Each of you however have a further problem! And I cannot advise you what to do about this! Just to point it out and see if you feel it is relevant to your situation! Neither of you is learning how to fall in love with the real person that each of you is! The relationship is the reality you are both living! It is your experience that tells you whether you feel yourself within it and both can grow so that together you each are improving each others life, trust,compassion, understanding and emotional stability leading to a happy love!

    Now for the circular reasoning again!!! Some of those things are already in your relationship but attached to negatively spiralling outcomes which feed back into reinforcing some of the positive ones and so the cycle goes on and on with an overall tendency toward disintegration and a sad outcome for all concerned!

    It is also the same with cult thinking - this 'negative association' with negative things attached to a loving provision!

    My advise is to look outside the box you are both in!

    It is called a HOLISTIC approach!

    If the whole is not improving markedly and continuing to do so then something is fundamentally wrong.

    (It is why I would never go back to that religion or now any organised religion!!-but that's another story if you ever ask)

    Unless you can agree together to focus holistically on both your ethoses in this relationship and enable continual positive growth - it is unlikely to change what you presently feel. And get this - if that idea about ethoses makes it obvious your interests are opposed, how can it be resolved? So think about those things for your own long term sanity!

    Short term - discuss the above with her if it feels right and see if it helps. Get her involved with a site like this where there are lots of people who have been where she has been. It strikes me that she has a big issue with her own belief in God - or not, and needs helping to a place where she feels secure that her own belief is what is in her own heart and her own head - after too many years of wrong connections! Not simple, not guaranteed and not a short term journey! Other than communicating with her, I'm reluctant to keep second guessing!

    Good luck for her, for yourself and as I'd say to anyone in the religion or outside it - follow what you feel and your own heart because noone else will if you don't!!

  • hubert
    hubert

    If you could get her to read "Crisis of Conscience" by Ray Franz, it will unlock the guilt in her head. She feels huge guilt for not sticking to the witnesses. She most probably won't want to read it, because it is "apostate" material according to the witnesses, but if you can somehow get her to read it, I am pretty sure it will remove the guilt feelings she has about leaving the cult.

    You should read it, also. It will convince you that the W.T. are phonies and not the "Faithful and Discreet Slave" as they proclaim to be.

    Bribe her, if you have to. Tell her you'll go to "one" meeting if she reads the whole book, and still wants to be a witness. (Watch out for the love bombing that you will get when you walk in the door). That's how they lure unsuspecting converts to get them to study with them.

    You are doing a great job so far, and I commend you for your efforts.

    Oh, and welcome to the forum.

    Hubert

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Hi FlyAway2,
    I just read your post. You are in the right place in some ways, there are plenty of people here who have been seriously hurt as JWs.

    There are those that are still mad with the organization, others that are mad with God, others that prefer to believe He doesn't exist any more, and others in varying degrees of numbness and confusion.

    But there are success stories, some people have seemed to find a new path in life and there are others that are now truly fulfilled.


    I personally believe that only Jesus can heal the deep rooted wounds left by life as a JW. Here are some verses written hundreds of years before Jesus was born.

    Isaiah 53:5 (New International Version)

    5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
    he was crushed for our iniquities;
    the punishment that brought us peace was upon him,
    and by his wounds we are healed.

    So I will pray for peace and emotional and spiritual healing for your girlfriend.

    All the best,
    Stephen

  • worldtraveller
    worldtraveller

    F2 welcome. I have noticed a common thread with Witnesses. They are programmed to be in fear. They are afraid. They spend their entire life trying to be saved, that they forget about how to live for today.

    I think you need to deal with the fear aspect. Try to show her how to deal with life today, as opposed to the end. If all you can think about is death, what is the point. Life here on this planet is about life. Focusing on death has no purpose.

    Also, if she still believes the Jehovah real estate corp is Gods plan, then she needs new light. There are many issues we have discussed that clearly show that the WT is a money making scheme full of pedophaelia, liars, and shunners.

    Do your best, but if she has problems, then professional help might be a needed step. Good luck.

  • FlyAway2
    FlyAway2

    Thank you to everyone for the responses.

    In reply, I have suggested therapy on many occasions when she gets to a point of asking me for help or what I think she/we should do. As much as I'd love to "save the day", I know when something should be left to a professional. The problem lies in that she still has it in her head that she's NOT to talk about the religion. To anyone. Period. The only reason I've heard what I have is because she knows me and trusts me enough, but even that gets hard-pressed when we get to certain details. When she's angry she says I'll never know who she used to be. I do love her very much and wish to stick by her. I should probably make that more known to her, I just fear making that commitment only to find she finally loses herself and then I'm trapped in a situation where "You said you wouldn't leave me, but you're just like one of them!" (family's cut her off) and sticking around to just watch her deteriorate. I could never live with the guilt of "looking the other way", but in all honesty there are times when she really tries me.

    Seeing the destruction the religion has caused just adds to my hate for it, which in turn makes it more difficult for me to hear her talk about it. I'm from New York so I know all about the Headquarters, the Farm, and spent my entire childhood listening to my father badmouth the witnesses and the organization itself. I had my own opinion as well, being that I'm rather open-minded and chose to draw my own conclusions rather than just parrot my father. And in finding myself in this relationship, I did as much research as I could into it to see if I could get a better mental grip on it, but it still is nothing more than an outsider's perspective. I've never been in it. And she makes that point every time. For a while, I'd ask her something about the religion that had been disproved by whatever it was that I'd read, and she'd hit me with the usual response, making excuses for everything, what they believe and why it's right, etc, and I'd confront her with the evidence and she'd blame it on my "not understanding". I do plan to pick up the Crisis of Conscience book, but I fear it will be met with the same rationalization.

    It is all so frustrating. Like dealing with two frames of mind. I know she believes in God (the God that truly is, as she says), and as much as she tries to follow what she feels is true, it's like her brain has been so, well, washed, that it drags her back to the only thing she knows.

    We have plans to visit church this Sunday. The Pastor has offered some help. Who knows how much good it will do, but we'll see. And Steven, I appreciate your thoughts and prayers. I do agree that Jesus especially can help, as I've had a relationship with him all my life, probably even more so then what I have with God. He has always guided me right and has never let me down. This is what I wish for her to see. It is what I wish for her to have for herself. Healing, and peace of mind in knowing that she is truly loved.

  • Shawn10538
    Shawn10538

    Your friend is experiencing a very common phenomenon among exiting cult members. It is called "floating." She fades in and out of believing the cult to be true one day, while haVING DOUBTS OR TOTALLY DISBELIEVING THE CHURCH on the next day. Check out books by Steven Hassan - Combatting Cult Mind Control, and Releasing the Bonds of Cult Mind Control. Especially the latter one is great for analizing the effects of cult control.

  • FlyAway2
    FlyAway2

    I agree, worldtraveller. Her fear was the first thing I tried to combat. Show her that real life is not what it was made out to be, that she can life for the day, that there are decent human beings out there who believe it or not WILL help out a complete stranger (she was in awe the other day when I was backing my truck up with a large trailer and a total stranger stopped what he was doing to help guide me back). But it seems the harder I try, the more she shuts down. In summation, I've seen her go downhill faster the more I try to acclimate her to everyday life. I'm careful not to overwhelm her, but it still happens, no matter how simple a task the day brings. Recently just getting her out of bed has been a challenge. There are random days however when she's as normal as I could hope for. Seeing her completely functional, strong, and positive is what gives me hope. The next day, it disappears without a trace. I'm really at a loss at this point, which is why I'm seeking advice from those who have been on the inside.

  • FlyAway2
    FlyAway2

    Well now I'm REALLY at a loss.

    I walk in the house to find her watching the religious channel. It's this woman, and she's comparing bible passages with a Pastor, and they happen to refer to God as Jehovah (Jireh?) a number of times. The passages were something related to Cain and Able, and one being cursed while the other was not, and the threats of losing all contact with family, living in poverty, etc, should one not do things God's way. That was all she (and I) needed to hear. I walked out of the room to keep myself from snapping. I really have to ask myself if I can deal with this, because it gets to me beyond what you could imagine. I apologize, I just needed to vent.

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