Are Prayers For Real?

by WTWizard 34 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  journey-on

  Gopher, your words gave validity to my earlier statement about prayer. Most people pray for better health, a better relationship,

  more money, etc. indicating the thought and subsequent emotion of fear of a lack of these things. So, when they project this vibration

  out into the "stuff" of consciousness, this negativity is what is strengthened. People erroneously think of prayer as asking an entity they perceive

  as a God for something, then sitting back and waiting for "Him" to either grant it or not. It doesn't work that way. As a matter of fact, it may even

  work negatively if the proper technology was not used.

  Faith is a big component. It is not just hope. It is not just wishing. It is very very difficult to grasp what it really means and even

  more difficult to acquire it and live your life with it. But, I firmly believe, that prayer done properly and with the right intention combined

  with faith can "move mountains". You have to work at it like anything else. Anything worth having is worth working for. If you're not

  willing to search for it like hidden treasure, why do you think you are worthy of it at all?
• 

  Robert7

  My personal opinion (being that I am currently Atheist) is that prayers are:

  1) Meditation
  2) Completely Psychological (the more you dwell on something, the more you believe it)
  3) Selective memory (remembering the few things that coincidently happened to convince those that it was answered)
  4) Comforting (helps you sleep at night, that you can talk to "god")
• 

  Caedes

  You missed the point. But this board is chock full of people who have shut their minds up totally to the

  possibility that there are actually forces at play that we cannot see nor comprehend at this time. Our

  science is still much too small and inadequate. It has made great strides, but there is still so much to

  be revealed. Quantum physics is opening new doors all the time. Perhaps a new branch of science

  will widen the path. But many of you have the firm mindset that if Science can't show me now, then it

  doesn't exist. You are afraid to stay open-minded for fear you will be thought a fool. Tsk...tsk.

  Everything is vibration, including thought, feeling, and emotion. Scientific experiments have been done that

  explores the relationship between vibration and form. Geometric patterns can be created in materials such

  as water, oil, and certain powders using certain vibrations. These patterns are simply the visible form of an

  invisible force. Who is to say that the vibration created by the RIGHT thought combined with RIGHT feeling and

  RIGHT emotion doesn't create a disturbance in the "stuff" they are projected into....the refined substance of

  consciousness. Each has an effect. When it comes to prayer, be open-minded enough to entertain the possiblity

  that if done correctly using the proper technology, you can "move mountains".

  No, disagreeing with you does not mean I missed your point, You have a hypothesis for which you have presented no evidence. I sated that I remain skeptical of your hypothesis due to lack of evidence. If you think that means that I lack courage that is a non-sequiteur. Your lack of evidence has nothing to do with science and it's progress or lack of progress or its current state of knowledge.

  On the contrary to what you state, I am entirely convinced that there are forces we do not currently understand. You then claim that I am close minded because I reject something for which there is not one shred of evidence, that is what is known as being rational not close minded. I am open to anything for which empirical evidence can be shown. You haven't even been able to show that there is an effect in the first place let alone the 'science' that you think explains it.

  The patterns that you mention are simply interferance patterns caused by interconnecting waveforms, so what? I f you can control one with the power of your refined substance of consciousness then you might have something!

  In the meantime I am open minded enough to listen to your evidence...when you get round to finding some.
• 

  journey-on

  What empirical evidence do you want? Millions of people attest to answered prayers. They are certain to the core

  that their prayers were answered. They can't tell you how or why, but they KNOW it with certainty. All you can say

  is that the outcome would have been the same whether they prayed or not. You don't know that. I have had a personal

  experience (mine only) that convinced me 100% that prayer is real. Nothing and nobody can change that. It happened. It was real.

  It could not have been a mere coincidence, nor my imagination. You nor anyone else could ever convince me that my experience

  was anything other than an answer I desperately needed.

  Science will probably discover the realm of pure consciousness someday and how forces operate within it, but not by scientists whose minds are

  closed to the possibilities. If you want to continue to think that man is nothing but an evolved animal, then so be it. I choose to try to connect to the

  intelligent creative energy force in play in the universe, and I believe without a doubt that there is a method to communicate through the technology

  of prayer and that man is a conduit from the realm of pure consciousness to the realm of physical matter here on this planet. If that sounds "unscientific"

  to you, that's okay. It matters nary a byte to me.
• 

  Caedes

  Journey-on

  I would be willing to consider any empirical evidence. Lots of people used to attest to the healing power of blood-letting, the placebo effect was probably strong in those people too. The placebo is a very real effect, read up on it, experimentation has shown that people who were prescribed placebos reported improvements in their condition in line with the results they were told to expect. When the authority figure telling you what to expect is effectively god then I am not in the least bit surprised that people are 'certain' that the effects of prayer are real.

  I have heard lots of stories of people recovering from all kinds of illnesses through the power of prayer but not one amputee has had a limb regrow. So are the prayers of amputees not that important to god?

  I am sure you feel that you got the answer you needed, unfortunately that is insufficient to make me believe that prayer works.

  Science has discovered 'the realm of pure consciousness' it's called the brain. If you are trying to suggest that there is some kind of energy that we can control with our minds then I think that is extremely unlikely, since neither you nor anyone else has been able to provide one shred of evidence for it. As for your other wild claim, science is very open minded, providing there is empirical proof for something.

  If you want to continue to think that man is nothing but an evolved animal, then so be it.

  How very kind of you to allow me to think for myself. I am so grateful. But what has the fact of evolution got to do with the practical efficacy of prayer?

  intelligent creative energy force

  I presume that this is your euphamism for god but what exactly is the 'technology of prayer' I can only presume that some conman has convince you to part with your hard earned cash for a box with some flashing lights 'that helps to open the lines of communication between you and your own personal intelligent creative energy force through the technology of prayer(tm) only £24.99'

  It is not a case that what you wrote 'sounds' unscientific, you have not one shred of evidence and choose to communicate using phrases that only you know the meaning of, that is unscientific. Science deals with facts and evidence not answers that you desperately need. That is what differentiates it from pure speculation