The Gun Story You Did Not See This Week (page 4)

beksbks

Here's another gun story you may not have seen.

http://www.comedycentral.com/colbertreport/videos.jhtml?videoId=164013

Lest you fall for the way Dr. Kleck gets called a knuckle-dragging Neanderthal by some of his critics, Dr. Kleck is about as bleeding-heart a liberal as it gets. I personally know one of his former students. When he started his study, his objective was to do a study with the same conclusions as the study I criticized, but much more extensive and authoritative. The idea was to come up with a study which would effectively end the debate in favor of the gun control position.

But he found that the data did not support his position when analyzed honestly. And he had the guts to state his finding. And that knowing how his liberal colleagues would react. The man has guts!

Forscher

beksbks

So I've just watched "Bloody Sunday", and had several glasses of wine. Got the tears, heart is open. What's the answer Forscher? Everybody put a gun under their pillow? Tell me, how do we stop so much senseless violence?

BurnTheShips

" Tell me, how do we stop so much senseless violence?" It is a mind problem. Not a gun problem. Large parts of our society have lost their way.

Forscher

What's the answer Forscher? Everybody put a gun under their pillow? Tell me, how do we stop so much senseless violence?

Burn the Ships has the right of it, though I'd argue that many never really knew the way to go in the first place. Banning guns won't stop the senseless violence to begin with. And even though permitting law-abiding citizens to own and carry handguns is demonstrated by study after study to reduce violence, I will admit that it will not eliminate it either. Only through changing attitudes towards the use of violence and instilling our children with better attitudes in that respect will result in the sort of massive reduction in violence which the gun control crowd fantasizes complete gun bans will produce. When it ceases to be cool to resort to violence, the we might see something to crow over.

In my youth it was much easier to have guns and carry guns in the places I lived in. At my high school one could go to the student parking lot and see rifles and shotguns hanging in the back window of most pickup trucks. All the males, almost without exception, carried knives in their pockets. My own personal knife was a barlow with a 5 inch blade. I even saw students in school with hunting knives strapped to their waist. Yet nobody threaten another student with a gun the whole time I was in school. And only once was a knife pulled (the local gay guy pulled one on a girl who'd taunted him and the other guys standing buy forced him to put it up).

However, in big-city schools where possession of both were banned, knifings and shootings in race and gang quarrels were rampant. I think the most important difference between the two was not the bans, but rather the fact that rural guys used their guns and knives as tools for hunting and respected the destructive power of both as a result. Those in the city didn't. Even at that, in those cities with long standing gun restrictions one can find a very big difference in violent crime from the draft era to the non-draft era. Those forced into the army or other military service were taught to respect the destructive power of their weapons and during wartime saw the effects of those weapons up close and personal enough that the majority came to respect life and the destructive power of guns.

That, by the way, is why veterans of our current conflicts have a much lower homicide rate than the rest of the population (though the MSM is trying to give the opposite impression with recent articles). Now I am not advocating bringing back the draft, far from it. But I think requiring supervised training in the proper maintenance and use of firearms should be required for incoming freshmen in high school. That is the only way to instill respect for what a firearm can do. I would also like to see the movie industry stop churning out films filled with gratuitous violence. But that'll be the day hell freezes over, so it isn't going to happen.

Forscher

beksbks

Just a few thoughts on contributing factors. I think living in a constant climate of fear and distrust is as bad as the glorification of violence in movies and games. The lack of connectedness in the population is huge IMHO. Here in California, new houses are being built at frankly, an alarming rate. One thing about them, is that the houses themselves are huge, but they have virtually no yards. We can now spend zero time through the day actually interacting with other people. Work in a cubicle all day, communicating by computer, check out at any given store, the library, the gas station, the atm, all at a "self check" machine. Then go home and shut the door behind us, never meeting our neighbors...........etc. The idea that "they" (whoever they are today) are to be feared and blamed for any problems is so prevalent, it reminds me of growing up as a JW. Poverty and lack of hope for the future, or any kind of link to society seems to me a big part of why our prisons are so full. A respect for society, it seems would need some feeling of being part of it. To me the places to start would be education, economy, and sense of community. School programs that enrich, like sports and music, which always seem to be the first to go.

Aaaghh I'm rambling now. Need more coffee, and a good dose of sunshine.

PS guys, I am not naive enough to think we can, or would even want to ban guns (some types maybe), but I do think there needs to be country wide standards of ownership. Maybe you have to take a class, pass a test, etc. Why not? Isn't it about safety of ourselves and others that we need to take a class and pass a test to drive a car? So much of it is about money. I don't believe the NRA is actually working for the rights of gun owners, as much as it for protecting the profits of the industry.

beksbks

Forscher,

The study cited by beksbks bucks the majority of studies on the same issue.

The article I posted sites at least 3 different studies.

FlyingHighNow

YOU and I KNOW that the real problem is/are bleeding heart liberals

I know plenty of democrats who own guns. I also know republicans who don't own guns and hope for gun control. I personally think citizens without guns makes for a very vulnerable set of circumstances. I am not a republican. I am a moderate. I will vote democrat this election.

Try to remember when gun control became a big issue. When Reagen was shot. Who was the fellow who was shot with him and they made a law connected with him?

beksbks

Brady

BurnTheShips

In my youth it was much easier to have guns and carry guns in the places I lived in. At my high school one could go to the student parking lot and see rifles and shotguns hanging in the back window of most pickup trucks. All the males, almost without exception, carried knives in their pockets. My own personal knife was a barlow with a 5 inch blade. I even saw students in school with hunting knives strapped to their waist. Yet nobody threaten another student with a gun the whole time I was in school. And only once was a knife pulled (the local gay guy pulled one on a girl who'd taunted him and the other guys standing buy forced him to put it up).
However, in big-city schools where possession of both were banned, knifings and shootings in race and gang quarrels were rampant.

Robert Heinlein once wrote: An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.

Burn

The Gun Story You Did Not See This Week

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