NAZI GERMANY alive and well in OAKLAND ... "Pre-Crime" searches

by What-A-Coincidence 13 Replies latest jw friends

  • Fadeout
    Fadeout

    AGuest: I understand presevervation of 2nd and 4th Amendment rights are important. I think preserving lives is more important, however, and if you lived in Oakland, you might agree....

    Anyway, again, I understand the threat to 2nd and 4th Amendment rights. But if you lived in Oakland, you might think the safety of citizens might outweight those rights, right now.

    It is truly baffling to me that people can say "I know your rights are important, BUT, HOWEVER....."

    Huh? What's more important than freedom? Isn't freedom supposedly worth dying for? "Give me liberty or give me death"? Or, for those whose historical awareness comes entirely from Hollywood, Mel Gibson's Braveheart: "Freeeeedoooommmm!!!"

    When we get to the point where we're saying, "We'll give up our rights to solve this one particular problem," we're now taking those rights for granted.

    And tomorrow, when someone else wants to take away another one of our rights to solve some other problem, well, now there's precedent, isn't there?

    Maybe we should just join the Watchtower again. After all, if we just follow their rules, we'll never overdose on drugs, never contract an STD, never lose all our money in Vegas, never join a gang. Of course, we'll have to give up some freedoms, like freedom of speech, the freedom to pursue a profitable career, the freedom to obtain secular education, and the freedom to use our lives according to our own will. But hey, our safety from those bad things "outweighs our rights," doesn't it?

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    May you hav peace!

    I am going to try to respond to the following from as honest a position/perspective as I can:

    Huh? What's more important than freedom?

    Now, I don't expect you to understand this, but, apparently for SOME... life? That of themselves AND their children?

    Isn't freedom supposedly worth dying for? "Give me liberty or give me death"?

    Technically, perhaps. For the white anglo-american/european world, it appears that might be the case (however, we do need to keep in mind that the same folks who made that statement, and who advocated and fought for "freedom" literally enslaved millions of others). It was the case for native americans. However, for others, not necessarily. If it were the bottom line, I think a LOT more slaves would have risked escape... or taken their own lives. The fact that so many did not should answer this for you. The fact that people in, like, Afghanistan and Iraq are not fighting against their respective oppressors should answer that.

    Or, for those whose historical awareness comes entirely from Hollywood, Mel Gibson's Braveheart: "Freeeeedoooommmm!!!"

    Freedom is a good thing, absolutely. But I think you might be forgetting that laws... are for the lawless. True, it is SHAME that this is what it has come to. But I bet you one gagillon dollars that if YOUR 10-year-old was shot by, say, some 15-year-old... YOU would want to know how the 15-year-old even got a gun, and why someone... anyone... didn't take it away. I don't think, if you could roll the tape back to before the event, you would say, "Hey, look, you guys got no right to go in there and take that kid's gun, even if his parents consented, and you parents should'a never let them in."

    I think that if folks are going to ACT like felons, they may find themselves being TREATED like felons under certain circumstances. Ordinarily, felons have no rights when it comes to possessing firearms. They are subject to search... of their cells, their homes, their vehicles, their person... at ANY time. Certainly, then, MINORS, who thus are ILLEGALLY possessing weapons... which would make them FELONS... might have to give up their rights. Here, it is the right to refuse to a search or seizure of their property. Such a search might actually RESULT in freedom for these, however: they might NOT shoot/kill someone and end up incarcerated... and stripped of their "freedom," maybe even for the rest of their lives.

    I also think that most of the PARENTS of such minors would rather have their house searched and a gun or drugs found... than get a call that THEIR child... has murdered/killed/shot someone else's. I know I would. You see, I could get over having my "rights" violated. I could get over having my child's "rights" violated. I could get over my child doing time for drugs or possessing a firearm. Or whatever. And if they were framed and the search illegal, I would fight for them. I would not leave them alone.

    I could NOT, however, get over my child killing someone else's child... intentionally. And accidentally ain't much better, either.

    I bid you peace, dear Fade.

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • horrible life
    horrible life

    This statement, is worth reading, and remembering, each day. My daughter found this statement while writing a paper a couple of years ago. It made a profound impact on me. I remember it, when I read the paper, watch the evening news.

    It also applies to our lives as Jehovah's Witnesses. We found the strength to leave the security of the cult.

    Freedom is priceless.

    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either.
    Benjamin Franklin
  • AGuest
    AGuest
    Freedom is priceless.

    Whose freedom? The guy who has the illegal gun that he's going to use to kill my loved one? Or my loved one's... TO live?

    Peace!

    SA

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