So how do you uncult a cultist?

by easyreader1970 14 Replies latest jw friends

  • easyreader1970
    easyreader1970

    This is my wife I am talking about. I'll get that out of the way first.

    She was essentially born into the Truth and she is hardcore. She is a zealot. If the WBTS tomorrow said that moon men were coming and that we should build a spaceship to fly to mars, she would be the first person down to Home Depot. That sounds like an attempt at humor, but it is not. It is true.

    I have been baptized since I was fifteen but a few years ago I swallowed the red pill.

    I desperately want her to take the pill too, but I don't know how she can. She is fiercely obedient to the WTBS. It doesn't matter if they issue commands that don't make any sense.

    I can't come right out and express doubt, even if I am just expressing it as a thought process. She'll have me sitting in front of the elders before dinner time. And I know she will do it. I got angry a couple of times many, many years ago when we were first married and I uttered the dreaded F swear word. Guess what? Elders. Little meeting in the back to discuss my "anger problem". There was a time when I stopped having the family study regularly and she threatened to go again. By now, you're asking how I can put up with this? Three kids, that's how.

    The "announcement" has caused her to go into frenzy Witness mode even more than she already was. It's making my life more hell than it was before. I could sort of tolerate it for the kids before but now it makes my brain hurt, the nonsense that is coming out of her mouth. One time in the past few months I openly thought differently than the WBTS about a subject and she said "You are bordering on apostasy!"

    Yeah, so ... Have any of you been successful in slowly seeding (to use the WBTS terminology) the cultist so that they can begin to see and not be blinded? I read once that someone can just try to just study the Bible in the family study alone, without literature. I can't do that. I tried, she freaked. The best we can do is read it, perhaps assigning different parts or characters to different people. But to try to just read and analyze the Bible alone (with the secret goal of seeing how the Bible is nothing close to what the WBTS teaches)? She balks hard. If there is no literature then there is no study.

    One last but ultimately very important note: She is diagnosed bipolar. She's not the most stable person in the world to begin with. If you rip the only thing she's ever known away from her, bad things are sure to happen. She's already emotionally distraught over the end of the book study arrangement. She has been upset since Sunday night when it finally set in that it was gone (or will be in a few months).

    I am really not looking at legal divorce at this point. I do actually still love her in spite of the cult we are stuck in. I also would not wish to damage the children. Yes, I know the cult is damaging but I think separation would damage them even further.

  • Mickey mouse
    Mickey mouse

    You know how the WBTS says you should never destroy an interested person's belief system before installing a replacement? I think there is a parallel in that you have to show someone there is life outside the WT. Another revelation to me was that the majority of people are decent human beings who aren't deserving of death. Try to share activities with your wife that are away from the borg. Take up a hobby together. If you push too hard too fast her JW defense system will kick in. Patience is everything. That's all I have.

  • WingCommander
    WingCommander

    Dude, you have got some SERIOUS problems here. The first problem that I see is that YOU are not the HEAD of YOUR household!! If your wife has the gall to report you to the Elder's for simply using the "F" word, then SHE is the one wearing the pants in your household. By JW standards, this is incorrect. It's time for you to install your long-overdue headship upon her, and let her know that reporting such trivial crap the Elder's will not be tolerated by you. If she does do this, and they come to speak to you about things, ask them if they have a 2nd witness to her allegations? Also, I'd let them know that interferring with your family headship isn't appreciated and also ask them if they have anything better to do than being the cuss-patrol? I bet that will shut them up!!

    Secondly, try your damndest to get your wife on some kind of medication - this is no way to live. Obsessive compulsive disorder and manipulative personalities run hand in hand with bi-polar and manic-depressive disorders - trust me - I KNOW.

    Other good things would be to encourage more of her hobbies, interests, extra-jw-cirriculum interests. Try and plan alot more family oriented activities AWAY from the KH activities, JW in-laws, etc. Once the stress is off of her she may change quicker than you think.

    Sounds like you've got your work cut out for you, best of luck!

    Regards,

    Wing Commander

  • jaguarbass
    jaguarbass

    Passive ressistance. Start drifting away and find other interest.

    If you find something interesting she might find it interesting also.

    Theres no guarantees in this life. It may work it might not work.

    I quit in 83. My wife didnt quit until 94.

    Now shes more gone than I.

    She celebrates all the holidays. She even climbs up on a ladder on the roof and puts up Christmass lights.

    You have a piece of work on your hands and the bi-polar aspect is a wild card.

    But if you have time on your hands and your in no hurry to go anywhere fast.

    Passive ressisstance and all its many angles.

    I think some people call passive ressistance the fade.

  • Qcmbr
    Qcmbr

    Institute your own BS study to replace the lost one but use that as your time together. During that time discuss:

    1/ How much she(you:) loves the WT
    2/ How good you are for each othet
    3/ What your relationship means to each of you
    4/ Joint beliefs that really seem important right now
    5/ Plans for future
    6/ Good memories
    7/ Things you have both accomplished together

    For this to work you can't do this with any overt ulterior agenda (even though you have one - I'd suggest you utterly put it aside for this brief time period). What this sort of thing would do is open up a forum for discussion where you can give her what she needs - support, feelings of acceptance, security and a strong partner. Once you've been doing this for a while I suspect that you'll have build a great deal of mutual trust and warmth and have removed the main draw and defence of any cult - cults thrive from being the ultimate bastion of certainty and acceptance and that's what makes them desirable for the confused, emotionally needy and lonely. Once you have reinforced your home as the place where these things happen you can then proceed to widen your discussions - these should always focus upon other churches especially topical problems (take the FLDS polygamy issue for example.)

    1/ Why these churches get it wrong
    2/ How people get to believe in things so much when they are wrong
    3/ What doctrines have caused christians problems both now and historically.

    and so on...

    You get to criticise and identify cult charateristics without attacking your wife or her beliefs, you get to strengthen your relationships, you get a measure of focus on your own concerns without confrontation. Given enough time you can both travel a path together rather than you running down it before she gets there. Ultimately you need to judge the situation yourself and ignore advice from others ..me especially!!:)

  • easyreader1970
    easyreader1970
    install your long-overdue headship upon her, and let her know that reporting such trivial crap the Elder's will not be tolerated by you.

    The "cuss-patrol" incident happened 12 years ago so I'm over that but I do know that she won't let me slide on anything. I am not sure how I can "not tolerate" something outside of just leaving, which is what I am trying to avoid. Remember that the WBTS takes the place of Christ. They always read the scripture about the head of woman being the man and the head of man being Christ but that's not what they teach. They teach that the head of the man is the WBTS, the elders, etc. So she feels within right to complain to the next biggest fish on the food chain if I start ****ing up.

    Secondly, try your damndest to get your wife on some kind of medication - this is no way to live.

    She is currently on medication but she is trying to get off thinking that the reason she get depressed and whatever is really because she isn't doing enough for Jehovah the WBTS. I think the reason could be because of the WBTS. But I can never say that.

    Try and plan alot more family oriented activities AWAY from the KH activities, JW in-laws, etc. Once the stress is off of her she may change quicker than you think.

    I'll try that and see what happens. Honestly, she is so entrenched I have my doubts but I am desperate at this point.

    er

  • Finally-Free
    Finally-Free

    Hmmm, how to unwash the brainwashing...

    alt

    It sounds like my ex was a lot like your wife. I was a bit too pushy with my "apostate ideas" so our marriage didn't last.

    W

  • Velvetann
    Velvetann

    You sound like a very loving and patient man. Its not easy living with a Bipolar person, I know about that. Its not easy living with someone obsessed with a religion like JW's either. You are coping with a lot and this must be very difficult for you and a unhappy time for you. In my opinion There is nothing much you can do but be patient and love her and hope she sees the Truth about the Lie . It just takes time and that is not easy for you. Your children are important but do you want them to grow up as JW's and shun you when they grow up if you leave the religion. That is a very important thing to consider.

    Right now you will just have to be subtle and bite your tongue or cause problems and have her throw you to the wolves (elders), whew that is not easy. Quirky was talking about the same thing today. He wasn't sure if he was going to have to walk home or not after spewing out his thoughts and feelings to his wife.

    I just feel so bad for you all out there that have spouses who are so into the religion. It does put a wedge between you and you all are to be admired for trying your best to cope with it.

    I have been there done that, but I was the one that was the wife that was so into the religion because I thought I would die at Armageddon if I didn't stay in the religion. My poor husband who had never been a JW was so shocked when I went back into the religion. He coped as best he could, we had two little kids. He was patient and did not push me, I finally saw the light and left 7 years later. There is hope for some.

  • MissingLink
    MissingLink

    Read "Combatting Cult Mind Control". When she's in non-cult mode, ask her questions that require a crazy answer. Then just go "hmmmm".

  • outofthebox
    outofthebox

    Wow. My heart goes to you. My family is also trapped, so I know what do you feel. Sort of.

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