by justhuman 14 Replies latest watchtower scandals
Both Greece and Turkey are lovely places to visit and they are both bursting with History
David
Yes, they are bursting with history. I would love to visit those places just for the biblical history alone - can you say Isle of Patmos?
But, lest we hijack JustHuman's reflective thread, I will bow out gracefully.
Sylvia
Thanks for reminding us Just Human. Similar things go on in Africa right now.
Genocide always sucks.
God/Jesus/Jehovah/Yahweh (your deity of choice) are watching saying " What? Don 't look at me!"
To call Turks "thieves" and "barbarians" who form a part of a "Vampire Nation" [capitol letters are yours, just human] proves that you are ignorant and childish. I call you "ignorant" because, as every one knows, vampires live in Transylvania, not Turkey. Now, if you were talking about Romanians or Hungarians, I would have to concede that you may possibly have a point. But to say that there are vampires in Turkey is just outrageous. Everybody knows that Turkey is full of dark-haired, dark-eyed beautiful women. I know why you hate Turks so much!!!! I think that you used to have a Turkish girlfriend, and she broke your heart. That's why you carry a grudge against all Turks, you little baby boy!!!!! Forget about that girl and find yourself another Turkish beauty. Turkey is a country full of good-looking people, and they have excellent coffee, But there are no vampires in Turkey.
Seriously speaking, and all joking asisde, your post reeks - it stinks - of Greek ultra-nationalism and fanaticism. Greek ultra-nationalism [just like German, Russian, French, Japanese, Chinese, or, dare I say it, American ultra-nationalism] is a very ugly and dangerous things. Even the most cursory reading of history will show that ultra-nationalists are cowards and liars. They wrap themselves in their nations' flags and spew their hate-filled words. Just consider the disastrous effects that ultra-nationalism had on Germany and Japan. Do you see what is happening in China now? Ultra-nationalsm iis the enemy of civilization, not the Turks.
You know, when I was at the university, I had a few close Greek friends. We spent a lot of time discussing politics. I believe that they were true patriots; they loved Grece as much as you, maybe more. In any case, they were very astute politically. We spoke alot about the Greek diictatorship. My friends told me how cruel the life was in Greece under the dictatorship. My friends also told me how there is still much corruption in Greek politics. In fact, they shared a very humorous expression with me, an expression that I still remember: "When there is an election in Greece, even the trees vote."
My astute Greek friends also explained to me how corrupt Greek politicians exploited and controlled ignorant people using anti-Turkish rhetoric and propaganda. My friends expalined to me that this anti-Turkish propaganda was lies and bullshit. But this propaganda was very useful for corrupt Greek politicians [and, as they explained, there are many corrupt politicians in Gree. ce]. Corrupt Greek politicians use anti-Turk propaganda as a trick to divert the peoples' attention away from problems in Greece. Actually, this is an old political trick. Corrupt politicians everywhere try to get people to focus their attention on an outside, foreign enemy so that they ignore domestic problems like...corruption. Politicians everywhere like to set up "strawmen" so that their people will ignore domestic problems.
My friends at the university knew very well what their own Greek politicians were doing. But my friends were not ignorant. They refused to allow themselves to be manipulated by cowards and fools. I urge you to be like them. Instead of focusing on Turks, you should focus on the problems of your nation.
For your information, Kemal Attaturk was responsible for modernizing Turkey. It was he who brought Turkey into the modern era. His vision for Turkey was to make it a secular state, In this respect, Turks and Americans have something in common - both peoples are very religious, and yet both peoples highly value secular ideas like the separation of church and state. In this respect, the argument could be made that Turks are closer to the ideas and ideals of the Enlightenment than the Greeks in that the Orthodox church is very powerful in Greece.
In any case, people are people all over the world. There are good and bad among every race, nationality, and ethnic group. Too often, ultra-nationalists and religious leaders "get into bed together." They plan and conspire to use ideology to manipulate and control people - their own people. This happens all over the world. It is certainly true in Greece. In Greece, ultra-nationalists are eager to kiss the asses of the Orthodox priests, and the priests happily reciprocate.
I can assure you that there are as many barbarians in Greek politics as there are in Turkish politics. As the expression says, the dividing line between good and evil does not cut across racial, national, or ethnic boundaries; this line cuts straight through the human heart. The dividing line between good and evil is within each one of us.
I
Good points Rapunzel...BUT
1. I was refering to the Turkish politic tactictics and not the people. In fact I do have Turkish friends that they agree that the Turkish Othomans have commited genocides And we are talking about genocides equal to the holocaust...the difference between Turkey and Germany is that Germans they have accepted their crime against humanity, and APOLOGIZE...while the Turkish regime considers those who say anything against the genocide as traitors...so by refusing their crimes it means that one day they will repeat it again...
2.At this moment we have Turkish people that they are fighting for democratic Turkey. In fact Turkey is being controled by the Army. They are the real owners of the Turksih State. That is why we see Mr Ertogan the prime minister having problems for reformation, because the Army will not step down from their power and control
3. I have seen the Turkish attrocities in my small country from first hand. Turkey invated Cyprus in 1974 an Island of 500,000 only. As result they occupied 37% of the north part, turn 200,000 peopel refugees in their own land. All of them lost their homes and property, and Turhey does not allow them to go back from more 34 years...I have seen our towns been bombed with napal bombs, more than 10,000 people killed in the invation, not to mention the brudality against the unarmed population(massive killings, rape,)2000 missing the smallest person was 6 months old, taken by the arms of his mother by Turkish soldiers..I have seen the ethnic cleansing done by the Turks in my country and most of all, I have seen our culture herritage being destroyed by the Turks. Christian monuments of 2000 years have vanished, and many other monuments of thousands of years old have being destroyed. Yes my friend this is was happened in 1974...I'm reffering to historical facts. Facts that have been recorded by Americans, British, Germans, regarding the Greek Genocide, because countries like France and other Europeans accepted the Armenian Genocide by the Othoman Turks
I accept the fact that there are corrupted politicians and in my country.By the way do you know any country that doesn't? Shall we take an example of U.S?
Vietnam war, the involvement of CIA in South America, the bombing of Serbia, the invation in Afganistan, Iraq a war that was done for controling the oil, and cost the lives of hundreds of thousands people, Iraqi's and American citizens? Not to mention the fact that the U.S president lied in order to make this war. Perhaps the involvement that Henry Kissinger had in the Turkish invation in Cyprus, and how did CIA desolve democracy in Greece in 1964?
Yes I do believe that by addmiting our mistakes will go on. I have learn to accept all the people, and I do have friends from many places in the world. I have muslim friends from Turkey, Pakistan, Iran, Armenians, Israel, Kurds just to mention a few. Only if we accept our mistakes our "mea coulpa" we will go on. Other wise we shall repead the same story over and over again and it will be no end to it.
