What exactly was the proper food at the proper time? (page 2)

leavingwt

leavingwt - Great graphic! Thanks!

Yes, it is a great graphic, and it's the work of Paul Grundy, at www.jwfacts.com

still_in74 wrote:

:JW's will claim that the fundamental doctrines were in place - no trinity, no hell fire, no immortality of the soul (except for 144k) to this day this seems to be the mantra of the WTS.

hoping4change wrote:

:I'd like to hear an explanation from a JW here why, supossing just for a moment, that the 'trinity of truths" listed is indeed %100 correct, why those 3 items would be enough for Jesus to choose them over others. Why can't trinitarians be wrong yet not receive the mercy of Jehovah or Christ when judgement comes, just as JW's must expect some mercy for all of the errors/mistakes they have made?

:Can any practicing JW's explain this to me?

Dang! I've always loved this topic best! Perhaps no other subject exposes the idiocy of Watchtower reasoning than this one.

I'm not a practicing JW, hoping4change, but no practicing JW can give a decent answer. Demonized apostates like myself are much better qualified, especially if one has been a demonized apostate for a long time. This is not due to superior intelligence, but merely due to the fact that over time after leaving the WTS, braincells start to grow back.

We'll start with one clarification: JWs do not believe the souls of the 144k are immortal. When their bodies die, their souls die. When God resurrects them, THEN he makes them immortal, not before.

One time I cornered my mother on a ton of WTS false prophecies, the evils of Rutherford and Franz and a bunch of other stuff. She couldn't refute any of it but blurted out, "well, at least we've got the fundamentals right, no trinity, no hell fire, and no immortality of the soul." Obviously, this is a common retort by dubs and deserves further examination.

Firstly, there are not 3 fundamental doctrines, but only two. Since dubs believe the soul is not immortal, then they cannot possibly believe in eternal hell fire. I guess someone could take the leap and say that God resurrects dead souls, then makes their souls immortal and THEN tortures them forever and ever, but that sounds even more stupid than having immortal souls to begin with which are then tortured forever after the body dies.

Now we are down to 2 "fundamental doctrines": no trinity, no immortal soul. How important are they that makes them so "fundamental?"

Therefore, the first thing one should say to a dub who uses this argument is, "if they are the fundamental doctrines that you have right as you say, then all the other doctrines you believe cannot possibly be fundamental. Otherwise, you would have also listed them. But stop and think about it. What possible importance to your life on earth do believing or not believing these doctrines have as you go about day-to-day living?"

Dub: "Well, we don't have to worry about God torturing us for all of eternity!"

Apostate: "But you DO have to worry about God incincerating you in front of the other Armageddon survivors, with your eyes rotting in their sockets as you roast, screaming in pain and die, leaving your pathetic lifeless body to be picked apart by birds. You DO have to worry about God topping a building on you, squashing your blood and guts from your body and smashing the tiny skull of the baby you're holding in your arms, if you don't measure up to Watchtower Standards(tm), don't you?"

The point here is it doesn't MATTER while we are alive whether we believe in soul immortality or not. It doesn't take care of our families, doesn't make us better people, or if it does, it is only because we are terrorized by God to be better people, and that would make any good we do conditional, or hypocritical. Put simply, what we believe about the soul at death doesn't matter. What happens after death, happens after death, and we can't do a damn thing about it. Since it happens at/after death, it doesn't meat SHIT while we are alive, and it doesn't make our lives any better or any worse.

Same thing is true with the Trinity. Dubs believe God is a "spirit", but no human alive can understand that nature, that essence of spirit that makes up the Creator of everything. So WHAT if that nature is some sort of mysterious Godhead, OR if that nature is some sort of individual spirit. So freaking WHAT? Can anyone make an argument that one's life is better, happier, healthier, more spiritual and more caring simply because that one does not believe in a so-called Trinity? Or DOES believe in a trinity?

"Dang. I'm so happy today. My life has totally changed since I quite believing in the Trinity! I got a raise on my job, I started volunteering to help poor people, I joined the Peace Corps, my kids started getting straight A's, and my ex-wife I and got remarried and I could have never been happy if I still believed in the Trinity!"

The bottom line is, those 2 or 3 "fundamental doctrines" don't mean squat in the real world where we must live and operate.

A dub might say: "Pleasing God doesn't mean going around and helping the poor. It means worshiping him correctly, and how can we worship him correctly if we worship a Trinity?"

Apostate: "How can you worship God "correctly" as some sort of "spirit" when you don't have a clue what a "spirit" actually is, except that it is invisible. Since God is invisible, I don't think he would expect you to understand his actual essence no matter what it is; if he does expect this, he's a bigger jerk than even the Bible makes him to be."

Apostate: "Jesus said there were only TWO "fundamentals": love God, love your neighbor. Why do you think the no trinity and soul sleep doctrines are more important than those Jesus mentioned? Practicing those two fundamentals Jesus taught can make a profound difference in your life and in the lives of all who know you. You won't know whether your two fundamental doctrines are important or not until you are dead, and maybe you won't even know then."

So you see, those dub "fundamentals" aren't fundamental to anything except speculation. They have nothing to do with making one a better person or Christian, or not.

Farkel

VM44

If the JWs consider "no immortal soul" to be one of their fundamental beliefs, then what do they believe is restored to life in the ressurrection?

Not the body as a new body is constructed distinct from the old.

Memories that Jehovah has retained of the person who died? Those could be implanted into a thousand created bodies, of what benefit is that to the original person who might have died thousands of years ago. Really could that person have the hope and expectation of waking up one day in body distinct physically from the one he had and that simply had his memories and personality implanted within it? What is the connection with him?

The Jehovah's Witnesses beliefs are bankrupt!

I wish The Watchotwer was as well.

Sasha

Information from the Lord God

WTWizard

The real food at the proper time is found right here on these apostate boards. I get to find out what the Filthful and Disgraceful Slavebugger is up to right now, and the objective meaning of it. Which to me is much better than the dog sxxx served at the boasting sessions.

Cheetos

It does not matter what the JW's claim, they are a distortion of the Bible Student movment and the fact that they hold to the history of the Bible Student's is a shame and a insult to the Bible Students. Anyway the "proper food" is the one true plan of god and how he will cure mankind through his son and remove death it is the understanding of this at the time of Russell. Russell did not ever seek to tell others what they can and can not do, as the J F R did. For the first time the simple and wonderfull plan of god was uncovered.

yknot

I believe the so called food was the publication....."" The Finished Mystery ""

JimmyPage

The proper food at the proper time was "miracle wheat".

Witness 007

The Faithful Slaves food gives me gas.

Alligator Wisdom

What exactly was the proper food at the proper time?

John 6:27

Food that was good yesterday but isn't today isn't food at the proper time (i.e. doctrinal changes). Proper food, Biblically speaking, never expires. Farkel hit the nail on the head with the two fundamentals Jesus Christ stated.

Alligator Wisdom (aka Brother NOT Exerting Vigorously)

What exactly was the proper food at the proper time?

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