The Sigh Thread (page 14)

beksbks

Hey what's wrong here? This thread has been neglected for over an hour now!

BizzyBee

Went to yoga. Now I'm back.

Where's Farkel?

OUTLAW

Farkel went dancing,with Micheal Jackson and Hitler.. Laughing Mutley ...OUTLAW

Im not so impressed with Furkle. No wonder he's sighing. He's sorta boring. Many pages of blah.

Hey Ferkel why not take some classes on personality development?

Im getting sleepy reading this one from ya.

(sigh)

Big Tex

From back in the day, when this board really was a discussion board talking about serious matters (geez I sound like a crabby old man):

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/10808/1.ashx

I feel compelled to post this as it is an issue that concerns me greatly. It is an issue that I think is significant, and just my expressing myself may help me to get over some of the feelings I have for the cold-blooded way that dubs treat not only the "world," but those of their own.
It's long, but it's also long, so tough!
Jehovah’s Witnesses are not from God. Jehovah’s Witnesses are not from the Bible: they don’t follow it and they don’t act upon its instructions and commands unless it suits the interests of their religious leaders and the agenda of those leaders. While there are many, many examples to prove this fact, I am going to focus on just one right now. It alone is fully enough to illustrate just how un-Christian and un-Biblical Jehovah’s Witnesses have become in the last seven or eight decades.
One does not have to believe the Bible is inerrant or even God’s Word to use it as a yardstick by which to measure those who do: people who claim to follow it wholeheartedly and exclusively as the sole guide in their lives either follow it or they don’t. If they follow it, at least they have integrity in the beliefs. If they don’t follow it, they are hypocrites. If they REJECT by their actions some of the pure and clear and simple and unambiguous instructions, they are liars, slanderers, evil and condemned by virtue of the Bible’s words itself.
Jehovah’s Witnesses who follow all or most explicit instructions and “suggestions” from their religious leaders are one such group, a group who has rejected some of the very words of Jesus Christ himself in favor of a selfish and materialistic pursuit of eternal life.
While I have written articles in the past on the subject matter at hand, I’ve never used this particular chapter in the Bible to showcase just how much out-to-sea the religious leaders of Jehovah’s Witnesses really are.
We are going to consider chapter 25 of the book of Matthew. Jesus is speaking to his disciples in this chapter who would also be those very disciples who would soon become “spiritual leaders” in the various congregations to be set up after Jesus’ death, What did he say to them, then? My 1984 edition of the NWT has this caption at the top of the page: “Do good to brothers.” Sound good, doesn’t it?
Starting with verse 31 we read:
“When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. And all the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one from another, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. And he will put the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left.”
My, oh my. I wonder what would constitute a “goat.” No one wants to be a “goat” on the left hand of Christ do they? Let’s see:
“Then the king will say to those on his right, ‘Come you who have been blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared from you from the founding of the world.”
(This single verse in itself presents some very interesting dilemmas, and I will likely comment on it at some time in the future, but to do so now would be off my topic of choice.)

“For I became hungry and you gave me something to eat, I got thirsty and you gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and you received me hospitably, naked, and you clothed me. I fell sick and you looked after me. I was in prison and you came to me. Then the righteous ones will answer him with the words, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty, and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and receive you hospitably, or naked, and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to you? “
Here Jesus is working up to a very, VERY powerful conclusion. He knew full well that his disciples took care of him and his needs. After all, he was THE only-begotten son-of-God, and they WERE his loyal followers.
“And in reply the king will say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, To the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.”
What a powerful conclusion he made! Jesus was clearly stating that helping out the LEAST of their brothers was as good as helping out Jesus himself.
Now, let’s see how the WTS treats these simple and pure words:
*** it-1 342 Blessing ***
Doing good to Christ’s brothers, God’s “chosen ones,” brings Jehovah’s blessings to “the sheep,” with the reward of everlasting life.—Mt 25:31-34, 40, 46.
Uh, Jesus wasn’t talking about some lame “doing good” to any “chosen ones.” He was talking about specifically giving charity in a very material way to the LEAST of his brothers.
*** it-1 1151 Hospitality ***
Those showing hospitality and kindness to Christ’s “brothers” would be doing it because they recognized them to be brothers of Christ and sons of God. (Mt 25:31-46) In another statement he showed that not mere humanitarian hospitality would bring lasting reward from God but hospitality rendered to God’s prophets because they are recognized as God’s representatives, disciples belonging to Christ.—Mt 10:40-42; Mr 9:41, 42.
Notice how the society attempts to downplay the words of Jesus I’ve just cited. They draw the fire away from the very clear instructions to help those “least” brothers (and sisters) with food, clothing, shelter and succor and flat out state that humanitarian hospitality is just not enough. One must also show hospitality to “God’s prophets” because they are RECOGNIZED as “God’s representatives.” Hmmm. I wonder who they are talking about here. Could it be themselves?
In my very desperate attempt to see if the society actually not only advocated but promoted the words of Jesus I’ve quote so far, I turned up this gem:
*** w97 3/1 18 Happy Are Those Who Stay Awake! ***
The shortness of the time left for this system of things heightens the need for wholehearted activity as we search for those “rightly disposed for everlasting life.”—Matthew 25:31-46; Acts 13:48.
Huh? Jesus was NOT talking about selling MAGAZINES and books in Matthew 25. He was clearly talking about offering necessities of life in order to help other fellow humans physically survive.
Here is an example where the society twists Jesus’ instructions to make it appear that ONLY the anointed are his brothers:
*** w97 5/15 13 When Jesus Comes in Kingdom Glory ***
Foretelling the warm, loving support that these “sheep” would offer his anointed brothers, Jesus said to them prophetically: “I became hungry and you gave me something to eat; I got thirsty and you gave me something to drink. I was a stranger and you received me hospitably; naked, and you clothed me. I fell sick and you looked after me. I was in prison and you came to me. . . . Truly I say to you, To the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.”—Matthew 25:35-40.
So, if the anointed are Christ’s “brothers,” then what are the non-anointed? Dog meat? Pond scum? Yes, and you can thank Da Judge for that. Between massive doses of alcohol and the finest of spirits during prohibition and after, he created a class system which divided the Christ and his followers. You non-anointed are NOT Christ’s brothers, you are Jonadabs, worker-bees, unwashed masses and dumb shits whose sole purpose in life is to SERVE those who have claimed to be of a higher “class” than you! And why? Because of an accident of birth, that’s why! Da Judge set the cut-off date to be or not to be “one of Christ’s brothers” at circa 1935. If you were a dub at that time, you are one of Christ’s “brothers.” If you were sadly unfortunate to become a dub after that time you are a schmuck who must SERVE, and care, and tend, and feed, and cloth, and supplicate Christ’s “brothers.” The Holy Spirits of Jack Daniels has dictated your eternal destiny, dear dub reader and you believe it. You don’t even qualify to be among the LEAST of Christ’s brothers he was speaking about. You’re a nobody who must suck-up to those “brothers” or face eternal death.
*** w97 9/15 17 Who Will Survive "the Day of Jehovah"? ***
By their zeal, cooperation, hospitality, and other good works, they bring great refreshment to Christ’s spiritual brothers yet on earth.—Matthew 25:31-46.
"5 Those who do good things for Jesus’ “brothers” because these anointed ones are his followers have the hope of surviving “the day of Jehovah.”
Jesus didn’t say squat about “zeal, cooperation, hospitality and other good works to Christ’s ‘spiritual brothers.’ He said “food, clothing, shelter and supplication.” The WTS will twist even the most beautiful and simple verses to suit their needs.
*** w97 9/15 31 Aristarchus-A Loyal Companion ***
Nevertheless, similar loyalty to Christ’s spiritual brothers and to Jehovah’s organization is necessary for all those in the Christian congregation today. (Compare Matthew 25:34-40.)
Jesus also didn’t say squat about “similar loyalty” to “Jehovah’s organization.” He was talking about “food, clothing, shelter and supplication” to the LEAST of the brothers. Will the society stop at nothing to demand robotic loyalty to themselves?
*** w95 2/1 12 A Great Crowd of True Worshipers-From Where Have They Come? ***
In this parable, Jesus showed that those thus given attention by the King would be judged on the basis of how they dealt with his “brothers.” (Matthew 25:31-46) Who are these brothers? They are spirit-begotten Christians who are therefore “God’s sons.”
I TOLD you that you non-anointed schmucks are not “Christ’s brothers.” You are nobodies who exist solely at their pleasure and to serve them and their whims. If the WTS is to be believed, Christ indeed has a divided house: the haves and the have-nots. The vast majority are have-nots who are ruled, manipulated, driven, worn out and discarded by only a dozen or so crème-de-la-crème of the “haves.” Some life.
I’ve only cited a few references to prove my point; there are dozens and dozens more I could call up, but I want to wrap this up. Before I do though, I want to show you why Jesus was SPECIFICALLY talking about helping brothers out in tangible and physical ways and not in some bullshit “spiritual” way in this chapter in Matthew. He could not be talking about anything else and here is why: could any human offer Jesus “spiritual food?” How could a human do that to the Son of God? NO! He was talking about CHARITY to fellow humans. Furthermore, there is only one reference I could find to the expression “spiritual food” and that is in 1 Cor 10:3 which simply states, “and all ate the spiritual food.” Yes there are references to “spiritual words,” “spiritual houses” and “spiritual gifts,” but only ONE small reference to “spiritual food.” Yet, the society has turned that simple expression into a whole BELIEF SYSTEM, and dubs and dub rags use that term dozens of times each week! The society has elevated a single short expression in the Bible into an entire Pharisaical system.
Back to Matt 25:
“Then he will say, in turn to those on his left, ‘Be on your way from me, you who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. For I became hungry, but you gave me nothing to eat, and I got thirsty, but you gave me nothing to drink. I was a stranger, but you did not receive me hospitably; naked, but you did no clothe me, sick and in prison, but you did not look after me.”
“Then they also will answer with the words, ‘Lord when did we see you hungry or thirsty or sick or in prison and did not minister to you?’ Then he will answer them with these words, ‘Truly I say to you, To the extent that you did not do it to one of these least ones, you did not do it to me.
In view of these ominous words from Jesus, the WTS has decided to totally ignore them and set their own standards for helping brothers and sisters.
*** jv 304-5 19 Growing Together in Love ***
Loving Help in Local Congregations
“Among Jehovah’s Witnesses, care for orphans and widows in the congregation, as well as for any faithful ones who experience severe adversity, is viewed as part of their worship. (Jas. 1:27; 2:15-17; 1 John 3:17, 18) “
No is isn’t, you liars, as we shall soon see:
“Secular governments generally make provision for hospitals, housing for the elderly, and welfare arrangements for unemployed people in the community at large, and Jehovah’s Witnesses support those arrangements by conscientiously paying their taxes. “
So this ‘caring for others as part of their worship’ is the simple fact that they pay taxes to governments which supports those who Jesus commanded them to help in the first place. Some “worship,” the paying of taxes! It’s REQUIRED.
“ However, recognizing that only God’s Kingdom can lastingly solve the problems of humankind, Jehovah’s Witnesses devote themselves and their resources primarily to teaching others about that. This is a vital service that no human government provides.”
It doesn’t matter that Jesus explicitly stated that the caring for the needs of their own in a most physical way was a major determining factor in their salvation or not, the mighty WTS has overruled that and stated the PRIMARY thing dubs should do is sell their magazines and books.
“In the more than 69,000 congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses worldwide, special needs that arise because of advanced age and infirmity of individuals are usually cared for on a personal basis. As shown at 1 Timothy 5:4, 8, the responsibility rests primarily upon each Christian to care for his own household. “
Oh, yeah? Well JESUS said the responsibility rests PRIMARILY upon those who wish to receive salvation, or not. He made that very clear in the verses I’ve already cited.
“ Children, grandchildren, or other close relatives display Christian love by providing assistance to elderly and infirm ones according to their needs. Congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses do not weaken this sense of responsibility by taking over family obligations.”
Jesus never talked about any “weakening” of responsibilities and I am outraged that this religion would dare use that expression. They are laughing at the very words of Christ himself and abrogating their responsibility because, simply speaking, they don’t want to be bothered and don’t want to spend the money.
“ However, if there are no close family members, or if those who have the responsibility simply cannot carry the load by themselves, others in the congregation lovingly come to their aid. Where necessary, the congregation as a whole may make provision for some assistance to a needy brother or sister who has a long record of faithful service.—1 Tim. 5:3-10.
Well, there you have it folks. Jesus made helping needy ones including the LEAST of the brothers (spiritually weak, lost, mentally deficient, etc.) a REQUIREMENT OF SALVATION and the mighty Watchtower Corporation has qualified Jesus statement to mean “where necessary,” "may make provision" (not a requirement, but an option) “long record of service,” and “faithful record of service.” How could the ‘LEAST of these, my brothers’ qualify for help with those regulations and policies? Where is the attention to the words that Jesus actually considered so important that he made eternal salvation dependent upon it?
A person who has a long record of service, but not necessarily “faithful” is screwed, and a person who has a very faithful but “short” record of service is also screwed. And even if a person meet every Pharisaical qualification dictated by the Watchtower Religious Printing Corporation there is still that stickly little "may make provision" they've slid in there.
To you dubs who are lurking, I want to say this: "Can you honestly say that nearly an entire Chapter of the Bible that is so clear and unambiguous should be taken at face value, exactly as it is stated, or not? Do you DARE to risk your eternal salvation on someone else's understanding of what Jesus meant by "my brothers?" Is it not possible that he was referring to people being willing to help out with charitable works towards the whole family of humans who are in fact his fleshly brothers? Since he was also human at the time he said it he could have meant exactly that, and was not just referring to his followers? Furthermore, do you think that Jesus in that chapter would further subdivide the whole family of human beings into not just his followers, but to a specific elite "Class" of his followers, i.e. those who claim to be anointed and ONLY his true 'brothers?' Would you risk your eternal salvation on such shit that was dreamed up by a drunken megalomaniac and that is now espoused and promoted by a bunch of senile high-school drop-outs as "truth?" Was Jesus making these very powerful and poignant points so that in the very last of the very last of the "Last Days(tm)" they would ONLY apply to some 8,000 people out of 6,000,000,000 people? Does this make sense to you? Will you risk your eternal future on such absurd reasoning?
What’s the final solution to humans who DARE question and twist Jesus clear and simple warnings? Oh, I think Matthew 25:46 sums it up quite nicely:
“And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life.”
What you sow, you shall also reap, mighty Watchtower Pharisees.
Farkel

Brother Apostate

From back in the day, when this board really was a discussion board talking about serious matters (geez I sound like a crabby old man):

I can only say that we all must look at ourselves through the lens with which we view others.

It is a reminder for all of us to be careful lest we become that which we find abhorrent.

Or, just as likely in my experience, that we realize that which we abhor is what we are.

BA- Time enough to pull the rafter from our own eye, methinks.

Dogpatch

BTW I just got an email from Finland from Stacy, the girl from Finland I mentioned on page 2!

She is still an anarchist and on facebook, but slim and pretty now. :-))

small world.

R.

SPAZnik

What's an anarchist, reeeeally? :O) Is that like the secular poli sci version of accusing someone of being apostate or an antichrist? I've been accused of two of those three. But I see myself as more of an ad hoc-ist at the best of times (aren't we all really when it comes right down to it) so I'm like, *sigh*.

AWAKE&WATCHING

Ahhh...I wish I had time to read more than the first page. I spent a few months being the queen of fluff because it was fun and sometimes that's what you really need to survive. I hope I never forget how to have fun.

That being said, I always read your posts Farkel. I think I have even posted that I am a true Fan of Farkel. You and a few others (nod to Gopher) have helped me learn to think. Something that I am not accustomed to. I am also in no way confident enough at this point to think that I can add much to an intellectual debate.

So... don't think that your posts mean nothing to those of us that don't often post on your threads. I am thankful that I discovered you early on and am able to go back and read old posts of you and other "old timers".

Dark chocolate syrup and raspberries. Yum.

The Sigh Thread

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